Comments on: If not for the women, do it for the puppies

by: Mickle

Thu, 29 May 2008 02:44:16 +0100

“Children, and animals, have the right to be abused, but they do not have the same rights as adult humans.”

I started to write something really long in response, but instead can I just say that as a librarian that has to explain to people on a regular basis that yes, libraries are here to serve the needs and wants of kids too, not just adults, and not just their parents, arguments like this annoy the shit out of me.

Like, up there with PETA’s women = meat campaigns annoys the shit out of me.

La Lubu

“That more people don’t realize this never ceases to amaze me.”

I’m guessing it’s more of the privileged of not getting what it’s like to be someone that is not them.

The only person that I know personally who was a victim of domestic abuse* not only fit a lot of the stereotypes (young, not terribly assertive, a little desperate for male approval), she was also able to get out very quickly because she could move back into her parents house. The same parents who then proceeded to not only pay off the debts he had accumulated for them both during their short marriage but also subsidize her housing for the next several years. And I don’t mean by letting her live in their house rents free.

*meaning: the only person I know that ever told me, obviously

by: SarahMC

Mon, 26 May 2008 18:59:49 +0100

I don’t know if anyone is still reading this thread, but if you are interested in supporting animal rescue and rehabilitation, please donate to local shelters/rescues in your area.
There are many breed-specific rescues out there, as well. They desperately need money just to keep the electricity going.

by: Erika

Mon, 26 May 2008 18:41:29 +0100

I’m not even sure that victims suffer from mental problems or self esteem issues at greater rates than people in general

Yes, they do and before the abuse. Predators are very good at identifying prime targets. Abusers know who to go after. They’re not going to waste their time on women who will up and leave after the first sign of abusive or obsessive behavior. They’re certainly not going to risk preying on a woman who’s very likely to go to the police.

I don’t agree with the assholes over at Broadsheet, and many other places. Those women are not at fault. It’s insane to blame someone for being too (supposedly) weak to leave when she was specifically targeted for that weakness.

by: inge

Mon, 26 May 2008 12:25:39 +0100

hamletta: Do we really care why they do what they do?

Yes. Because someone who does right for the wrong reason could just as well do wrong for the same reason.

Nothing wrong with mutually benefical alliances, but I bet you that sooner or later someone more worried about the animals than about the women will (or already has) propose the solution that abused women should have their pets taken away. Or something.

by: La Lubu

Mon, 26 May 2008 12:17:53 +0100

Not to get too off-topic, but regarding the why-doesn’t-she-leave “phenomenon”—a big part is because she’d have to quit her job too. Without her job, she has no means to leave. It takes a lot of detailed planning (and saving) in order to leave. Otherwise, the abuser will just come to the worksite. The worksite is often the only place a woman will feel relatively safe. It shouldn’t be surprising that a DV victim would be reluctant to give up her job, especially in a shitty economy, and considering that without a well-executed escape plan, that up-and-quitting a job will have future ramifications for getting another job (and disqualifies a person for unemployment benefits in some states).

That more people don’t realize this never ceases to amaze me.

by: Bridgetka

Sun, 25 May 2008 22:21:28 +0100

I work at an animal shelter that partners with one of the organizations on the list. I was so psyched when we got together–I got to combine two passions into one! I’ve had the joy of coordinating a few intakes for DV survivors. Recently a woman came in sobbing, wanting to surrender her Rottweiler to the shelter. She said her boyfriend kicked her out and made her sleep outside in the rain, again, and she didn’t know where she was going to go but she knew her dog couldn’t come. She was clearly devastated, holding the dog close, her body wracked with sobs. I got her hooked up with the program, so that she would not have to relinquish ownership of the dog. When she was filling out the paperwork, there was a section asking for a way to contact her. She put the boyfriend’s contact info. I asked, “Do you really want us calling him? Do you have any friends or acquaintances we could call instead to get a hold of you?” She replied, “No. I have no one but him.” That broke my heart. Thankfully, I didn’t have to call this asswipe to get a hold of her; she ended up contacting us the next week to tell us she found a place and her dog could come. When she walked out of the shelter with that dog, she was radiant and so thankful that she got to keep her buddy, and the dog was overjoyed to see her. It was a fantastic feeling, and it’s a desperately needed program.

by: flea

Sun, 25 May 2008 14:25:57 +0100

Pippi’s sister is right, The Gift of Fear outlines exactly what abusers do to select and groom their victims. I loaned my copy to my sister, so I can’t refer to it, but I remember one example he gives was an abuser doesn’t hear the word “no,” and looks for women who give in rather than fight over things that seem trivial, like his offer to buy her a drink.

by: rhiain

Sun, 25 May 2008 13:54:53 +0100

prohibition on deliberate cruelty to pet animal

I actually really like this idea. It would also perhaps turn out to help out victims of DV–if the abuser already has a violent felony on his record, it might force the authorities to take the victim more seriously. And it’s not like there’s not a correlation, as has been pointed out numerous times.

by: mythago

Sun, 25 May 2008 13:18:25 +0100

PETA realizes that a pet is under your control

PETA believes you shouldn’t own pets, aka companion animals, in the first place.

by: Alara Rogers

Sun, 25 May 2008 08:31:38 +0100

I believe we should make deliberate cruelty to pet animals a felony. I don’t personally give that much of a shit about animals per se, but the prevalence of people who will abuse animals before graduating to humans, or the people who will abuse animals that people love as a proxy for those humans, is huge, and there is currently nothing that can be done about it. Murder someone’s beloved pet cat, causing them enormous emotional trauma? Get a slap on the wrist, maybe have to pay a fine. The guy who, in road rage, threw a woman’s pet dog into traffic? Nothing happened to that guy.

It’s bullshit. Like I said, I’m not coming at this from the perspective of loving animals per se — I eat meat, I have no illusions that it’s a nice life for the animals that I eat. I’m all about protecting *humans*, though, so a prohibition on deliberate cruelty to pet animals — any animal that actually is someone’s pet, plus the protected classes of cats and dogs — that actually had teeth in it, something that carried a year or two of jail time and a felony record — would help a lot. I mean, you’d have to write it carefully so the self-defense killing of a vicious dog and the euthanasia of a dying animal could not be considered cruelty, but the motivation for harming a pet animal is too similar to the motivation to harm people.