The biggest pinch.
Brad has a post up about the alarmingly high prices that gas could reach in the future, and he asks people how they’re coping.
But seriously: we need to solve this problem because it’s not getting better. I’m fortunate in that my current job allows me to work from home once or twice a week, although I’m still spending around $50 a week on gas. I’m trying to organize a group of my fellow employees to pitch in for a shuttle service that will take us from the commuter rail to the office every day; how are the rest of you coping?
Luckily, I barely have to drive, since I work from home and live in the city, which means I can walk or bicycle almost everywhere I go. I even braved bicycling to the dentist and back to get a filling done. (My first cavity ever, and my reason for concern was I had no idea how scary it would be and whether or not I’d have to be sedated. Luckily, no. I’m not that big a weenie.) I think I drive to Marc’s studio more than any other place, and even that will probably not be an issue after we move even more central in a couple of months. I often seriously consider selling my truck, but a pick-up truck is a useful thing to have and I just know that if I did sell it, then the next month would be when I started to have need to haul shit around. In fact, the new place has a garden, so I’ll soon have a more immediate need to haul large amounts of compost and mulch, so there you go.
My main concern at this point is inflation of everything else, especially food prices. I don’t drive much, but I eat a whole lot, and food is getting expensive, and I think transportation costs are a big part of it. And of course, oil costs affect the cost of growing or raising the food in the first place, so rising oil prices hit food production at every point in the process. Americans are doing a lot better than people in other parts of the world, but still, it’s a belt-tightener.
What are your concerns? Not everyone can do what I do and just bike everywhere they need to go. What creative solutions to high gas prices have you come up with?
This is going to get very ugly. (It’s about to change from groaning and moaning to outright crushing wallet.
$6/gallon is now very possible.
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601082&sid=a_GLOk1M9aws&refer=canada
Oil Rises Above $134 on U.S. Supply Drop, Bank Price Forecasts
“What we have here is a situation where essentially higher prices aren’t generating any more supply,'’ Paul Sankey, an analyst at Deutsche Bank Securities in New York, said in an interview with Bloomberg radio. “What we have to do is keep pricing the commodity higher until demand starts falling,'’ which “is around $150 a barrel.'’
Crude oil for July delivery rose $1, or 0.8 percent, to $134.17 a barrel at 9:04 a.m. in Sydney in after-hours trading on the New York Mercantile Exchange. It touched $134.42, the highest since trading began in 1983. Prices have more than doubled in the past year.
Yesterday, crude oil for July delivery rose $4.19, or 3.3 percent, to settle at $133.17 a barrel.
The best solution I’ve come up with so far to solve the food prices issue is to do as much shopping as possible outside the supermarket.
Most stalls at my neighborhood farmer’s market have not jacked up their prices noticeably, because the food is transported a tiny fraction of the distance that supermarket food typically is.
If you join a CSA, you pay one upfront price directly to the farmer at the beginning of the season, which means that regardless of what happens to prices over the next several months, you’re taken care of. Especially so if you find creative ways to preserve the excess for the lean winter months when you don’t get a CSA dropoff every week.
Also, this is probably a no-brainer, but seriously: go vegetarian. My grocery bills are a fraction of what my more carnivorous friends pay.
I still can’t believe I heard a conservative I knew argue that after adjusting for inflation, gas prices aren’t any higher than 10 years ago (and this was someone who scored a perfect 36 on the math ACT.)
We are less squeezed than many because we live where we have a lot of options and our house is relatively cheap to heat and light. Not having to car commute helps enormously, but we are still working to eliminate unecessary trips in the car. It helps that the closest grocery stores, one fancy and one cheap, have reopened after remodeling. We have pulled out the old burley baby cart to haul groceries and cut some car trips. We are relying more on the bikes for family transit within a narrow sphere, and my heavily subsidized transit pass helps too.
Soccer games in far flung suburbs are a pain in teh arse … but we do combine shopping trips and errands and everything else on the way to and from to maximize the fuel use. I can’t believe people actually drive back and forth to those places every day, passing our area en route! Owwwwwchhh … For example, Zog took the boys to older boy’s game yesterday. I took my folding bike on the T to the end of the line, and biked three miles to join up, arriving midway through the first half. The four of us then went to dinner and raided a Costco on the way home.
Meanwhile, food is getting more costly (hurts when the 12 year old has been doubling his intake), heating costs were up even for natural gas and electricity, and I am concerned about the coming winter. I am also concerned about a summer trip for my mother’s memorial party, but we have decided to not rent a car and get around by transit and Amtrak.
After a SIXTY DOLLAR fill up last Sunday, we have talked about starting a mileage jar and charging ourselves for certain types of convenience car use. If the kids ask to go shopping at the mall and want to take the car rather than bike or take the T, they pitch in 50 cents a mile for the privilege. If I decide to take my kayak ten miles away to paddle a different river, I throw in $5. If I drive to work, I pitch in $7. The point isn’t to collect money, the point is to think about options.
My spidey sense is telling me that whenever people say that gas prices are going to get to $6 or $7 dollars a gallon, they are being a tad hysterical.
How much of an analogue is the current gas situation to the Carter era? Slightly better? Worse?
Also, this is probably a no-brainer, but seriously: go vegetarian. My grocery bills are a fraction of what my more carnivorous friends pay.
It makes sense, but there is a flaw in your plan considering the fact that eating vegetarian means that you could no longer eat bacon, cheeseburgers, or steak.
Some idea of increased costs …
10 lb bag of flour retrieved from the attic after kitchen renovation: $3.29
5 lb bag of flour purchased last week: $3.49
eating vegetarian means that you could no longer eat bacon, cheeseburgers, or steak.
All of which are typically the cheapest food options, of course.
Seriously, if you are cutting out meat to save money and/or be more ecologically sensible about food, you don’t exactly have to swear on a stack of bibles never to let another bit of meat pass your lips. A BLT once a month or so isn’t going to make much difference, and it’s getting easier and easier to find sustainably raised beef for an occasional splurge.
The real savings comes when you cut habitual meat consumption out of your diet.
While I’m still temping I find I have to drive a lot because public transportation in L.A. isn’t very reliable on short notice but I was at a central location for about five weeks and I took the bus to and from work, which saved me quite a bit on gas those five weeks. Once I have a permanent job I’m probably going to buy a monthly metro pass (especially if the company will help pay for it, like some of them do) for the buses/subways and invest in a bike:)
CH:
Clearly your conservative collleague has been sniffing fumes, since ten years ago my hourly wage ($9.00) bought 7-8 gallons of regular unleaded (around $1.15/gal) whereas this week my $9.75 only buys, um, just over two gallons ($3.83 this evening, curious to see how much it goes up overnight. Prices changing every few hours in this area.)
Coping? I live in a small city / large town that’s a little too spread out for walking to be time effective and has no public transit. I’m working about 4 miles from where I live but it’s a route that’s not bikeable for me right now (up and down hills, heavy traffic, no bike lanes and I’m fat and approaching middle age). I carpool with my Other Half who works in the same building. This is an improvement from the last job I had where I was commuting 150 miles a week (15 each way).
There’s going to be wage pressure. No alternative. In some ways I’m fortunate - as a temp, I negotiate my wage with the agency, they negotiate their contract with the client and keep the spread. I’ve been doing this for years and basically tell the agencies that I need a higher wage to work more than 10 miles from where I live because I’m not spending more than 10% of my net pay on fuel for commuting. ($9.75 x 40 = $390 less taxes is about $315 a week, net; 10% of that is $31.50 and it just cost me that this morning for about eight gallons.)
YEah, I know it means I lose jobs further afield and lower paying, but the revolution has to start someplace.
Seriously, NO, the rise in gas prices are not inflation. 9-10 years ago I remember a couple of the cheaper gas stations in my area actually had gas slightly under a dollar per gallon. Now it’s inching towards $4.
I’m pretty sure inflation has not multiplied everything by 3 or 4 in the intervening years. I pay about the same rent as I did when I moved here 8 years ago. I don’t make significantly more money than I did then, either, even with a college degree under my belt. The price of most consumer goods seems to have stayed pretty stable during that time, too.
The only basic expenses I can think of which have gone up significantly in the last decade-ish are food and transit. Oh, and movies in the theater, but that’s kind of random.
I just recently checked out the (poor excuse for public transit) bus routes in my area to see how easy/difficult it would be to get to my newest (temp) job.
It only requires two buses - one I can pick up a few blocks from my house that takes me to the main hub downtown, and then I can switch to one that takes me to my office. This trip will add an additional 4 hours to my day (2 hours each way). My job is only across town, and not a very big town.
Although monetarily it is much cheaper, I am trying to weigh the value of 12 hour workdays due to transportation, when it only takes me 15 - 30 minutes to drive to work.
Also, in re: to a vegetarian diet being cheaper, I don’t find that to be the case in my area. Produce is outlandishly expensive, and when I try to “eat healthy” I end up spending about 2 to 3 times more. I do find that produce from local food stands is cheaper, however.
“My spidey sense is telling me that whenever people say that gas prices are going to get to $6 or $7 dollars a gallon, they are being a tad hysterical.”
Paid $3.79/gal for regular unleaded this morning. That was at the best station I know of in my area. If I wanted, I could have paid over $4/gal. Diesel is within a few weeks of being over $5/gallon (Best price I know is $4.79/gallon right now).
“How much of an analogue is the current gas situation to the Carter era? Slightly better? Worse?”
Circa 1979: China was still depending on the bicycle as primary transportation for most people. India was not much better.
Since then, their consumption has gone through the roof as their economies have grown and allowed people to get goods and services (and cars) formerly unheard of. Most of this stuff involves oil in some way or other.
Between them, China and India account for about 37% of the world’s population. That kind of impact is not trivial, and doesn’t just go away.
No oil producing country has any incentive to lower prices because there are plenty of buyers for every drop. Production can probably only go a little higher than the level it’s at now.
As long as there’s still enough supply, we’ll just have to learn to cope.
Having lived through two “gas crises” when you couldn’t get gas even when you could afford it - that is something I’m not looking to repeat.
It took $38 to fill my Toyota. It hurt, but I’ll live. At least I can get back and forth to work. (I have to fill about once a week)
But if I can’t get gas at all? That’ll be really ugly…
Well, plan (A) is that the job I’m applying for offers me more money than my current one and allows me to make better use of public transportation.
If that doesn’t quite work out, I continue to make the decisions I’ve been making to cut down on discretionary expenses like going out to dinner, buying music, and getting “luxury” groceries, like cheese, which can add a lot to my grocery bill.
I do fine and am in no position to complain. Insofar as I have expenses, the largest of them are completely discretionary (eg, my rent, which is a function of where I choose to live). Because I’m feeling the pinch with food and fuel, I can simply choose to make better decisions. Some of it is a good thing: by no longer eating at my office cafeteria, I eat better food, as well as saving money, but I have less time, because I have to budget for taking time out to prepare all my meals for the week.
There’s a degree to which I realize that I’m not in control of my own destiny: I have to work where I get a job, rather than work in a place near where I enjoy living. This is making me think that the long-term plan is to ensure that all of these decisions are my own, perhaps by going into business for myself.
I’m worried about the price of food too. I bus to school mostly, and have been doing ok on my grad student stipend, but I’m guessing the U isn’t going to give us a cost of living raise, even though my average grocery bill is about doubled.
“Although monetarily it is much cheaper, I am trying to weigh the value of 12 hour workdays due to transportation, when it only takes me 15 - 30 minutes to drive to work.”
Here here. I would have to drive at least 4-miles just to get to a bus stop. Then it would probably take upwards of two hours to get to work riding the bus.
Same back home.
Driving takes about 25-35mins in, and 45+ back, depending on when I leave.
Those extra 3-hours/day would make the difference between having a couple hours of downtime after work and before sleep, and basically just hitting the sheets when I get off the bus.
Not a pleasant thought…
I work in IT, so it’s possible that if the crunch got too bad, they might loosen up their current rules basically forbidding telecommuting. In that case, things wouldn’t be too bad…
It’s not so much about “eating healthy” (which, at least if Whole Foods and the like are any indication, mainly involves eating expensive). It’s about cutting out the meat. You’re buying less stuff, and what you’re removing is a big ticket item. Yes, it’s true that if you replace meat with exotic soy products, or if “vegetarian” = “salad”, yeah your grocery bills go up. And if all you eat is hamburger helper, sure, almost anything else you could buy would work out to be more expensive. But eliminating the meat from your spaghetti sauce, the chicken from your stir fry, making the veggie alternatives to chili and lasagna, and the like really are cheaper than having meat as the centerpiece to every meal.
Well, it’s always nice to know, the crazies still think they can brute force it. (and snap, $5 oil climb)
My prediction. Iran will launch their gun boat again for little TV show against the aircraft carriers in the gulf. And oil price climbs another $2.
I even think, the OPEC countries now will react toward the chance of Hillary (miss obliterate Iran) winning election. We’ll see what May 31st meeting will do to oil price. (probably nothing. But I wouldn’t be surprised if it climbs up)
http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20080522/pl_nm/iran_usa_dc_1
Rice: Iran must make “right choice” in nuclear row
Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice warned Iran on Wednesday that if it did not make the “right choice” and abandon sensitive nuclear work it faced more punitive action from the international community.
http://www.boston.com/business/articles/2008/05/21/house_votes_to_allow_us_to_file_suit_vs_opec/
House votes to allow US to file suit vs. OPEC
WASHINGTON - The House of Representatives again approved legislation that would allow the United States to sue the Organization of Petroleum Exporting Countries under antitrust laws.
The House approved so-called NOPEC legislation by a 324-to-84 vote yesterday. It approved a similar measure last year by a 345-to-72 vote and the Senate voted in favor of it. The measure was stripped out of an energy package after President Bush said he’d veto it because of the NOPEC language, a threat that was renewed Monday.
Oil in Tokyo market is now $135. It’s full planetary panic mode now.
This is Enron fucking grandma Millie scheme again.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20080522/bs_nm/markets_oil_dc_22
TOKYO (Reuters) - Crude oil soared to a fresh record high above $135 per barrel on Thursday as a surprise drawdown in U.S. crude oil inventories and a weaker dollar prompted heavy fund inflows into the market.
Investment funds flocked into the market based on its strong performance, with key U.S. crude oil having surged more than 20 percent since the start of the month and geopolitical and supply concerns keeping traders reluctant to sell.
Opponax -
Less meat is certainly less resource-intensive, but thanks to our fucked up system of farm bills, it’s not necessarily that much cheaper. A pound of broccoli florets costs $4.99, while a pound of boneless, skinless chicken breasts is $3.99. Admittedly, you could go cheaper with a full broccoli stalk, but you could also get a whole chicken. Ground beef is $3.99, Red peppers are almost $6.
It blows.
(prices from freshdirect, YMMV)
I bought a cheapie bread machine and some cheap bulk yeast and whole grain flour, I’m shortly going to switch to baking all the bread for my family rather than buy it. We’ve also been eating a lot more beans and rice, but even fricking RICE has been going up in price a lot!
I have tried to become a vegetarian before, and it is simply not healthy for me. I gain weight and feel very sluggish if I don’t have fairly large amounts of protein, and red meat especially appears to be something I am genetically programmed to need. I buy less of it now, and stretch it by making big casseroles and stews and soupls, basically I make it last a lot longer so I can still have some every day.
Also: BUY A CROCKPOT! So many cheap and nutritious things you can make with it. Plus, buy the cheapest cuts of meat, throw them in for 12-24 hours, and suddenly they are tender and moist and delicious.
Fresh Direct is probably the most expensive you can get in terms of groceries, by the way. It’s a cut more expensive than the most expensive supermarkets in NYC, the most expensive city in the country.
Also, the answer there is another good hint for saving money on food.
Don’t buy pre-chopped and packaged broccoli florets. Buy broccoli.
I buy fresh bell peppers, and NO FUCKING WAY do they cost $6 apiece. I guess they might cost that per pound, but unless you’re cooking for the Duggars you won’t need pound upon pound of bell peppers. A recipe that feeds 4-6 people will usually call for one bell pepper. If you can’t afford a bell pepper, you are probably already so poor that you don’t usually cook with fresh vegetables anyway.
And again, if all you are eating is ground beef and nothing else, sure, buying anything but ground beef is going to become more expensive. But if you’re already buying produce, to which you are adding meat, subtracting the meat cannot fail to be cheaper. That’s how math works.
Seriously, I am not talking out of my ass, here. I am vegetarian. I save a lot of money by not buying meat.
It always shocks me how hostile people are to eating even slightly less meat. Even just to save money.
My main concern at this point is inflation of everything else, especially food prices.
I work for a food distributor. We also have a refrigerated trucking business. We move your food around. When you carry freight for someone, you charge $x per pound per mile. You also add a fuel surcharge. 4 years ago a fuel surcharge of 12% was considered to be high (it costs you $400 to ship your food plus another $48 for the fuel surcharge). Today, our fuel surcharge is 46% (it costs you $400 to ship your food plus another $184 for the fuel surcharge) - other companies are charging over 50%. Food prices are rising because of fuel costs. This is what happens when you scrap your rail system in favor of trucks.
It’s going to get much, much worse.
Is group buying going to be fashionable again?
I imagine group buy with restaurant will be that much cheaper. (not sure they allow that or not)
things like broccoli, pepper, onion lasts forever right? They are mutants veggies. (heh)
I live in Japan, in Tokyo. I don’t have a car, nor do I need one. I use my bicycle for grocery shopping and commute to work by public transport. Due to never-ending congestion in this city, public transport takes you to your destination faster, and as an added bonus, you don’t need to look for a parking spot once you arrive. If I buy heavy items (potted palm, baby bath tub, 20kg bag of rice) I have it delivered. Delivery services get your stuff to you the next day, within a time slot of 2 hours - 8 to 10, 10 to 12, whatever you say. We used to have a car, but I don’t miss it. Parking fees, gas, toll road fees all added up to substantial amounts. Now I walk, or bike, and if the weather is horrible, I take a taxi. So far, I haven’t felt much of the price increases.
Oh, I think Chicago will hit $6-7 easy this summer. The cheapest I saw today was $4.19. $4.50 for cheapest regular is not hard to find. Gas prices flirted with $4 hovering around $3.98 for a couple weeks, but once they crossed the $4 threshold, all bets were off.
I used to say I thought we’d hit $5 by August, now I think by the end of June at the outside. And I totally expect that once we cross the $5 barrier, it’ll be $5.50 two weeks later.
My sob story…I have a Dodge Durango. I can’t fill it up anymore, b/c gas stations cut you off at the pump at $50 ($75 in nicer parts of town). That won’t fill my tank if it’s empty.
Yes, my gas mileage is execrable, but what I am really supposed to do? We had the surprise baby last year, and it’s really too late to give her to Catholic Charities.
All three kids need car seats/boosters. The 4 y/o is TINY–I keep hoping she’ll really break through to 30# sometime soon, b/c she shouldn’t be in a booster until then.
The boy is a giant, but at 7 he’s not supposed to be out of a booster for 20 more pounds and 5 more inches.
These are laws in Chicago/Illinois. Your children have to be in car seats, reverse-facing till both 1 and 20#, forward facing till 30# and boosters until 4′8″ and 85#.
A Volvo is the only car I know that can fit 3 car seats in one row, and even a used Volvo is out of our range. That leaves a giant gas guzzler as our option. Gotta have a third row seat.
And we drive the hell out of it. The kids go to the magnet schools, and the younger one is in preschool, so only a half day, which leaves me commuting without enough time to make it there, home and back anyway, so I stay down town until I can pick everyone up. We put 15-20 miles on the damn car every day. In stop-and-go traffic b/c if it’s not winter it’s construction here in Chicago, and all the roads are blocked off.
I miss being single. I didn’t own a car here for 12 years. Didn’t miss it. Couldn’t figure out why anyone wanted one. Lived within walking distance of grocery stores and had bus stops and el stops right outside my door or within a block. And gas was cheap then.
Kids have to go to schools and doctors and swimming lessons. And regular families can’t afford 3 bedroom rents by the lake where all the public transit is.
Yes, it’s ugly out there.
Caren, i live an hour south of the city amidst corn and soy fields, and gas here is already $4.05 a gallon. when my fiance left for class this morning it was still $3.92. it jumped 13 cents in one day.
as to what im going to do? not sure. im a full time student and i have to drive in order to get to the community college. if gas gets so expensive i have to choose between groceries or college i imagine ill drop out of school and find a crap minimum wage job within biking distance.
It always shocks me how hostile people are to eating even slightly less meat. Even just to save money.
I remember when my mom and I first went totally vegetarian. My mom noticed the grocery bill went down, and told her very frugal and meat-loving boyfriend about it. You could practically see the desire to not spend money and the desire to eat meat dueling in his head.
I say when we first went totally vegetarian because growing up meat was something we only ate at dinner, and not every night. This wasn’t due to any ideological notions about meat, it was because we didn’t have much money so we were eating what we could afford. That meant not much meat.
As for my current situation, I wake up every workday morning and fight with myself over whether to take the car and have a forty minute commute or drive to the park-and-ride and have a three hour commute involving three trains and a bus. Given that I work friday night and saturday morning, I still find myself driving more often then not. Honestly, I’m counting the days until my lease expires and I can move somewhere at least closer to the trains. The trains certainly save me money, but it’s hard to stomach such a long commute. And until I find a full-time job I’m losing money either way. It’s just a matter of how quickly I want to lose it.
I don’t think high gas prices are going away. In the long term that’s probably a good thing, since reducing oil consumption simply isn’t going to happen without major incentives to shift our patterns of use. In the short term, that means a lot of misery for people towards the lower end of the economic scale. Just about any major shift in the economy ends up screwing the poor, since they have little or no buffer to help with the adjustment.
I wonder if things might move more smoothly and faster if there was a guarantee that gas prices would stay high - that would make it worthwhile to invest in projects that reduce transportation costs. If gas was to stay at or above $4/gal it might make sense to set up a business running commuter taxi services that take a regular group of customers to and from work. The problem is up front investment - you buy the vehicles, set up the system, and boom - gas is under $2/gal and you’re broke. If the price is certain to stay high, the investment has a chance to pay off.
I bike ride everywhere, but I am lucky enough to live in NYC, where driving is not a necessity. I am twenty minutes from school and work, so even if it’s too cold to bike (I think that happened once last winter), then I can walk or take a wealth of buses.
As for food, prices in NYC are so crazy-high anyways that I really haven’t noticed much of a hike yet. I guess if I had to recommend something cheap and fun to eat, I would say make your own chili! It is full of beans, veggies, and pretty inexpensive meat (unless you want to get fancy and use steak or something). You can freeze tons of it and defrost it whenever you get hungry. Great with grated cheese!
Olmert proposes naval blockade on Iran- report
nice. very nice. no wonder oil price explodes.
http://www.reuters.com/article/latestCrisis/idUSN21431390
Israeli Prime Minister Ehud Olmert proposed in talks with a U.S. congressional leader that a naval blockade be imposed on Iran to try to curb its nuclear program, an Israeli newspaper reported on Wednesday.
The Haaretz daily quoted Olmert as telling Nancy Pelosi that “the present economic sanctions have exhausted themselves” and the international community needed to take more drastic steps to stop Iran’s efforts to obtain nuclear weapons.
I went back to college for the first time in 8 years in January. I chose to go to UM-SL rather than any of my other 5 choices, solely because there’s a metro station at the school and another only a 15-minute drive from my house. In a crappy public transport city like STL, that’s a very big deal. I have just stopped driving otherwise unless it’s absolutely necessary.
It’s a pretty depressing issue.
The prices won’t go away and they won’t get any better. I’d like to think about working on a solution, but it’s really impossible. Demand is increasing, supply is not, and the amount of oil available, period, is finite, and probably less vast than most people seem to think.
The only thing we can do to avoid something catastrophic is to decrease demand, and not by cutting a little here and there, but to drastically decrease demand across the board. It’s hard because most of us don’t live within even 10 miles of our workplaces.
I’ve gotten a job in Japan, and will probably use a combination of bicycle and train system if I get assigned to an urban area, or a motorcycle if I’m in a rural area. I hope that will make the gas thing manageable.
Not sure about food, haven’t done much grocery shopping in Japan. But when I was in Korea I ended up being able to eat for pretty cheap. Hopefully it’ll be similar. As long as you’re not dead set on western food, you’re usually good.
Cactaur Tamer?
I laughed.
I have to drive for work, because I often have to be at several locations per day. I hate driving, but I can’t do my job if I’m wasting 2-3 hours out of my work day on bus trips. I checked and some of my 15-20 minute car commutes would take at least 40 minutes on the bus. If I didn’t get reimbursed at 45 cents/mile, it would be pretty bad.
I’m hoping that the gas price increase will force people to demand better public transportation. When I lived in NY, the price of gas wasn’t even on my radar. I just took the subway, the bus, or I walked. If I had the same job there that I have now, I would’ve taken the public transport for all my trips without having to risk my employer questioning my use of time.
I think the real problem is not the price of gas, which is in line with what the rest of the world has been paying for years, but the fact that we just don’t have adequate public transportation, so most people are tied to their cars because they don’t have any other options for getting around. It just boggles the mind that there are cities in this country where you can’t bike because there are no bike lanes and can’t walk because there are no sidewalks in some areas!
Same with grocery prices - if most food items were produced locally and the rest delivered by rail, we would have less of an issue. We just need better public policy on the issue of public transport, but instead we get politicians discussing that “gas tax holiday” nonsense.
Israeli Prime Minister Ehud Olmert proposed in talks with a U.S. congressional leader that a naval blockade be imposed on Iran to try to curb its nuclear program, an Israeli newspaper reported on Wednesday.
Sorta like what you did to Japan, in 1941.
How did that work out again?
squashed, why the fuck can’t you write proper English?
There are all sorts of reasons to think that the price of gas isn’t going to go down, and may increase rapidly in the near future. In Europe, gas is already around $8/gal, and yet people still tend to own cars; in fact, traffic continues to get worse in Paris and Amsterdam (and will probably get immediately worse in London if the new Tory mayor scraps the congestion charge).
Before long we’re going to have to give up commuting from exurb to exurb. The upside may be that doing so may actually allow more of us to tighten our belts.
A personal note: I’ll be driving from southern to northern California this weekend for a family event, and driving my sporty little rice-burner will still be cheaper, for two passengers and cargo, than the bus, the train or the plane, and quicker than any but the last - and not that much slower than flying. In much of Europe a comparable route would be much faster by train.
See, when I see a regular commenter who regularly mangles English, I simply assume that the person doesn’t speak English as a first language. I respect them for trying, considering that I don’t have any ability to write in any other language. (Even when the person is as consistently wrong as Squashed.)
Eric, on the other hand, just gets pissed off and cusses at them.
Why the fuck do you get so pissed off, Eric? Is the blogosphere an English-only zone to you?
The liberal/left needs to put the issue into class terms. While high prices are forcing poor and working class Americans to tighten their already tight belts, oil companies are reaping record profits. Overseas we are starting to see a few food riots here and there, and absolute hunger is starting to increase. Also higher prices don’t take us one step closer to addressing the environmental side of the issue.
Progressives should emphasize collective action against the situation and not how we can best accommodate austerity.
Multiethnic west coast truckers show the way:
Stockton Truckers Call Out the Industry with 400 on Strike
http://www.iww.org/en/node/4169
There is a British documentary, “Supermarket Secrets” on google video.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-5774892958354867332&q=type%3Agpick
It deals with many aspects of our way of food preparatin and consumption, including wasteful transport.
Why does Britain import chicken from Brazil, or fly homegrown vegetables to Poland to be prepared and packaged and then fly them back to be sold?
To name but a couple issues. Food that is grown near the supermarkets is transported hundreds or thousands of miles before arriving the shelves.
Another good documentary is “Controlling Our Food” on google video. It deals with GMO’s.
I picked my new job because it was in walking distance - for a minimum wage non-FT, my paychecks would have gone right back into the car otherwise. I could walk most anywhere in my town… but there’s honestly nothing in my town to want to walk to.
A lot of the hostility comes from your assumption that because something is true for you it must be true for everyone else too. I have gone through phases when I ate almost no meat. I’m not hostile to vegitarianism at all, but your tone is even making me want to fight with you. Changing from a meat centered diet while maintianing proper nutrition is not simple or easy for everyone. I tried for years, but I have a carniverous family and continue to need red meat during my period. For many cultures there are traditions and serious emotions tied up in meat-eating as well. None of that is trivial.
I moved across state lines not too long ago, and in the process lost all my knowledge about local food stands, etc. (or, rather, it became less helpful–I could still tell you where the farmer’s markets were in my old city, but those now being 400 miles from me… yeah.)
Does anyone know of any websites / databases with listings for things like farmer’s markets? I’m in New England, if that makes a difference.
My family is at the point where we have to start seriously considering cutting things like internet, dropping the house phone in favor of cell phones only, and cutting cable TV out altogether — we have already cut down to the cheapest level of cable that basically gives us three local stations and one news station.
We’re lucky enough to live near the train station, so the husband takes public transport. (Of course, SEPTA is fomenting yet another strike for this summer, so we’ll see how that goes…) We have one car, that I fill up once a week, to the tune of about $60/week. Yes, it’s an eeeeevil SUV (Ford Explorer), but I have three kids in car seats. Plus,I own the sucker outright — no car payment. At this point, “no car payment” still trumps “gas prices” — not that anyone will take SUVs in trade anyway. We just have to bite the bullet and ride this through.
If gas hits $6/gal, we will still be OK; we will be eating a lot of peanut butter. If it hits $8, someone will have to get a second job.
Re: Gas prices vs. general inflation.
Gas was cheap — too cheap — for most of my lifetime (born early 60’s.) When you look at inflation-adjusted gas prices, we apparently matched the historic high (from 1918, then again in 1981) of around $3.10 in 2007 dollars. Now that we’re well above $3.50, we’re in uncharted waters.
I found this chart that shows the data.
Of course, people can argue endlessly about the appropriate way to calculate the inflation rate. For those of us in the Boston area and other hot real estate markets, we’ve felt that home prices were not considered sufficiently in the official inflation rate, but now that housing prices are stagnant (at best), that makes gas prices seem even higher. We’re not taking out a mortgage to fill the minivan; that’s for sure.
Now I have to figure out: I’m near the top of the waiting list for a Smart ForTwo. Do I
Not by the Smart to save money in a tight budget, and rely on my bike as a primary vehicle?
Buy the Smart so we have an efficient year-round vehicle that doesn’t suck gas like our minivan does?
Buy the Smart and re-sell it at a profit since there’s a huge waiting list, then use the profit to buy cycling gear ?
Buy a Piaggio MP3 safe-on-the-ice 3 wheel scooter?
Heat. It’s really cold in Massachusetts in the winter. This year I lived somewhere that had heat included in the rent, which was great, and I think the next place will too. But I am a little scared of living somewhere on a tight budget that doesn’t. Cause then you’re broke AND cold.
Eric, Rejector of Memes May 22, 2008 at 2:22 am
squashed, why the fuck can’t you write proper English?
It pisses off all english major and environmentally friendly. It reduces fuel use from all heat generated.
New England Farmer’s Markets? Here’s the list for Massachusetts.
Perhaps because everything is cut-and-pasted from Yahoo News stories?
Perhaps because everything is cut-and-pasted from Yahoo News stories?
Why the fuck do you get so pissed off, Eric? Is the blogosphere an English-only zone to you?
It’s because the poor English is combined with condescending, borderline irrelevant comments. Poor grammar and spelling is just moderately annoying, and my own comments have their own share of typos. Condescending lectures in broken English with links to off-topic news stories under the guise of “educating” us just gets a person pissed off. If he’s so knowledgeable, how come he can’t figure out what makes an insightful comment and write it in proper English?
Man, I wish I could bus to work. I’ve looked into it, and it would take me more than 2 hours, with 2 bus changes and I’d still have to drive 5 miles to a park & ride, whereas driving takes me 20 minutes.
I drive a MINI, and the damned thing takes premium. It does get better mileage with 93 octane than with 87 (or even 91, which was premium out in OR), and it seems happier, so I keep putting in the $0.30 more per gallon gas. (What the heck happened to a 10-cent increase per grade??)
Mostly, I just don’t drive unless I have to, so it’s home - work - home, 14 miles each way, with occasional forays to meetings or a class. I fill up about every 2 weeks, to the tune of $45 or so. My husband is about on the same schedule with his Golf, though his car gets 87 octane. We use his car to go erranding on weekends.
I’ve considered a scooter/Vespa/moped, but you can’t drive them on the freeway
and I’m too chicken to go for a real motorcycle (and I’d have to change once I got to work, anyway.)
There’s no real public transit in the Triangle. There’s an extensive plan for light rail and expanded bus services … by 2025. Not so much with the useful.
I’m concerned that:
1. We’ll blame “big oil” even though all they’re doing (as far as I’ve heard so far) is what corp’s are supposed to do, make money for their shareholders and employees. Would it be better if they were another failing industry? Thank God they’re making money and successful.
2. Related. We’ll find a way (a gimmick) to artificially lower gas prices. Great. That will give the public what incentive? Duh. If prices are low, there’s no reason to give up your truck, your suv, your full size car, your 75 degree setting on your heat, your 69 degree setting on your a/c etc. Higher gas prices are the ONLY thing that will make people change their behavior. Yes, it’s the magic of the market, Adam Smith’s invisible hand, all the things you all hate so much.
3. We’ll continue to ban virtually all new oil drilling for the vast reserves we (the US) know we have, but don’t access (yes, you can all freeze in the winter, ride your bikes to work, and eat less so that some God forsaken animal you’ve never seen “maybe” “might” be effected. Good for you).
4. We’ll continue to effectively ban, through regulation and litigation, nuclear power, even though it’s used safely and successfully EVERYWHERE else in the world.
5. We’ll continue to pretend that ethonol is a good idea. How’s that working out? Oh, people are starving. Oops. That was the gov’t endorsed “solution.” Good call. Hope they run the medical system a bit better when Obama or Clinton are elected.
6. We’ll continue to ban wind farms near the homes of rich and powerful people (like you know who - not allowed to say his name while he’s ill). Hypocrites! Yeah, wind is great, but NIMBY.
7. We’ll continue to ban, through litigation and regulation, new refineries in this country.
Some of you are too young to remember the gas lines of 35 or so years ago. We shoulda learned then. But, we still haven’t, and probably won’t.
Those are some of my concerns.
$3.50/gallon. Is it really that low in most places?
I’m really sick and tired of the MSM reporting “average” price per gallon. Nationally, it doesn’t make sense, unless everyone’s paying the same rate. Locally, it’s usually a week or so behind.
Yesterday the “average” gas price in Chicago was quoted as $4.07. Again, I drive all over the place, and my inlaws live in the zip code with the cheapest gas and NO WHERE was it less than $4.16, unless you buy a car wash and get the $0.12 discount.
Cutting demand isn’t going to affect the prices at all. Oregon funds its roads with a gas tax. Oregonians have cut back on their driving to the point that the state is looking at alternative means to raise funds.
You would think that if an entire state had reduced consumption to the point the state government felt the pinch–that type of conservation should result in a lowered demand and lower prices, right?
Nope. Prices are the same as in Cali and Washington and the rest of the country.
Reducing our use isn’t going to help. Investigating the oil companies and fining the hell out of them for war profiteering might. If John McCain looks like he has a chance to win, then it might be in their corporate interests to lower prices temporarily.
Funny, how when prices spiked during the Clinton administration, the simple threat of Congressional investigation resulted in prices slowly returning to “normal”.
Money and profits are tight all along the gas/refinery/station line, but the oil companies are making record profits. Doesn’t that mean they could charge less? Yes it does. B/c it’s not a supply and demand issue, it’s a Wall Street issue.
A lot of the hostility comes from your assumption that because something is true for you it must be true for everyone else too.
I live in the most expensive city in the country, in the midst of hundreds of miles of urban sprawl. There is very little farming nearby. There are no big box stores with grocery sections in my area. I can’t garden. If I can save money by cutting down on meat, so can others. Besides which, it was just a suggestion — quick and dirty way to save money on food? Subtract steak. It’s not like I flounced into the thread and cried out Meat Is Murder.
I’m not hostile to vegitarianism at all
You sound pretty hostile to me.
Changing from a meat centered diet while maintianing proper nutrition is not simple or easy for everyone.
I didn’t say that it was, or that “everyone” should be a vegetarian. Just that getting out of the habit of centering all meals around meat saves money.
I have a carniverous family
Raised by wolves, were you? All snarking aside, you do not have a carniverous family. Humans are omnivores. If your husband and kids like their meat and don’t want to give it up, by all means keep buying it. But at that point we’re talking more about discretionary spending — I like having wireless DSL at home, but if times get bad, it’s going to have to go.
continue to need red meat during my period.
That’s, what, one week a month? As I said upthread, if you’re cutting meat for economic reasons, it’s not like you’re going to contaminate yourself or get kicked out of the Cool Kid Vegetarian Club if you have a cheeseburger every once in a while.
For many cultures there are traditions and serious emotions tied up in meat-eating as well. None of that is trivial.
Yes, you’ve found me out. I’m both Hindu and Japanese and thus have never actually had meat before. I was raised to dislike the taste and have no idea how to cook the stuff, or how I would incorporate such a foreign ingredient into meals. Seriously. I’m Cajun. My entire family hunts, and my mother gets visibly agitated when I deliberately order something meatless in a restaurant. I grew up in probably the most meat-loving culture in the USA. It’s taken me a lot of work to develop vegetarian alternatives to the recipes I grew up with.
And I’m not saying people really need to revolutionize the way they think about food. If you’re so inflexible that you can’t bear to leave the ground beef out of your pasta sauce, you might have more intense issues around food than the average person.
Tyro May 22, 2008 at 7:50 am
how come he can’t figure out what makes an insightful comment
Well, my post can be used to predict general trend of oil price for next 2 weeks. Each 2$ increase correlates to immediate 1-5 cents gas price. While your whining doesn’t predict the behavior of crude oil or grocery price.
(but if you are too limited to see correlation between middle east skirmish, crude oil price, gas price and general food item. I don’t know why you are in this thread.)
How about this: since you complains about how useful a post is. You propose an economic model to predict food inflation in relation to energy price. …
I am WAITING …
The dollar is worth about thirty or forty percent less than it did a few years ago (thank Bushonomics!) The refining capacity of the US hasn’t increased much lately (thank environmentalists, NIMBYs, refiners, and cheap crude oil prices!) Americans bought lots of inefficient vehicles in the past decades (thanks, consumers!) The world is seeing more people eat meat and drive cars (thank progress!) Crude oil production has probably peaked (thank reality!)
We’re screwed. Our way of life is unsustainable. And we have no one to blame but ourselves.
I’ve done the back-of-envelope calculations and determined that I can handle $10/gallon gasoline if I devote myself to weekend bicycling. It can be done. I recently had an $80 fill up and live in Tucson, which has about the cheapest gas in the country (go to gasbuddy.com to see your local stations and check out other areas.) I don’t know how others will cope, but I’m lucky.
Unless rationing starts.
Skyrocketing Oil Prices Stump Experts
Whatever the causes, one of the most dizzying runs in the history of oil prices picked up pace yesterday — again — as crude oil prices jumped to settle at more than $133 a barrel, up $4.19 in one day, 18 percent so far this month and more than one-third so far this year. Prices climbed even higher in late electronic trading.
The nationwide average price for a gallon of regular gasoline yesterday also set another record at $3.81 a gallon, up a penny a day for the past month, the auto club AAA reported.
www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/05/21/AR2008052100386.html?hpid=topnews
Any minute now I’m going to begrudgingly start taking the train.
Which I frickin’ HATE.
Thanks a lot Bush-whacker.
I’ll tell ya what’s expensive as far as food goes–getting diagnosed with celiac disease and abruptly being unable to eat 90% of what’s for sale at the local grocery store. Nope, not only do you have to find a store that sells gluten-free food preparation materials–which is as far as I can tell pretty much only organic markets–once you locate one, usually NOT within walking distance if you don’t live in the city–specialty foods are NOT remotely cost-effective. Bleh.
On the plus side, I deliberately bought a house last year that’s on one of the two major commuter train lines that run through my state, linking the major cities, so that really helps with the gas.
Gasbuddy for Chicago is all suburbs, not the city. But the BP next to the girl’s preschool is the 2nd highest! Whoo hoo! $4.45
All the highest prices are Chicago proper, of course.
Say, are all those “pro-lifers” gonna start subsidizing families with 3+ kids who can’t use small, fuel efficient cars due to the need to use 3 car seats/boosters? Seriously! If you want us to have so many kids, you gotta make it affordable, right?
Who woulda thunk gas prices would be a limiting factor on family size?
Libertarian:
1. Profit Über Alles. Which is fine, but do we have to give them tax breaks and give them cut-rate drilling rights on federal land, etc. If you do business in the US, expect to get treated like a business. We don’t have to subsidize them while they are so profitable.
2. The “gimmick” the Bushites found and promoted was the War in Iraq. How well has that worked out?…
3. If we raze Alaska from one side to the other (which some Alaskan seem to want) it still won’t make enough of a difference to matter, and we will lose the true value of the state. But hey, it’s just irreplaceable, what’s the big deal?
4. That’s just what we need: nuclear power plants operated with the safety and efficiency of our current FDA - Hear No Evil, See No Evil, Stop No Evil. Let every part of the US be like the radioactive wasteland around Chernobyl.
If nuclear power plants could be operated as safely and efficiently as…nevermind. There is not one single part of the government as currently operated under Bushite control that can be trusted to do anything safely and competently. And that was the plan all along.
Besides, it’s not clear that there’s enough fissionable material on earth to provide the energy we would need for any significant length of time, even if we had the plants already - which we don’t. And do you want a radioactive waste dump next to YOUR house?…
5. Ethanol IS a waste, as everyone who is not a Midwest corn producer has said for decades. But when ADM gets the government to do its bidding, that’s what we get.
6. Wind actually makes a lot of sense, and should be installed in many more locations.
7. This one really pisses me off. When is this ridiculous meme going to die? The oil companies want refinery capacity closely controlled. So THEY don’t want a bunch of new refineries built. Makes it harder to control supply. Duh!
The equivalent meme was around when California was getting screwed by Enron and the other electric barons - “Oh, we can’t build electric plants because of the tree-hugging dirty fucking hippies! Wah!” That was shit too. Electric Cos. want strict control over electric capacity for the same reasons, so they build new plants on a very restricted basis - not because of “environmental wackos” - but to control the market. The famous market you are so in love with…
“Some of you are too young to remember the gas lines of 35 or so years ago. We shoulda learned then. But, we still haven’t, and probably won’t.”
I am most definitely NOT too young to remember. And we SHOULD have learned. But the lessons we should have learned were not what you probably have in mind:
The Oil Cos. do not and will never have our interests in mind. The auto cos. do not and will never have our interests in mind. The government, which is SUPPOSED to have our interests in mind cannot be trusted as long as any Republican is involved. We must develop alternative energy without the help of business because existing business will do everything possible to sabotage progress. Business has always and will always have a strong bias toward monopoly and will always end up there in an unregulated business environment.
But hey, that’s Capitalism, baby!…
I really can’t afford to drive to work, but I can’t afford not to. I work in a small town outside of the city I live in at a rural service-area University. There isn’t a ride-share program in the summer, and its limited during the school year. I work during the day and teach at least once per week at night. I’m intending to join the ride-share program in the Fall, but I will have to drive when I stay until 9 p.m. and in the Spring that will be three nights per week. I’m staying at my current position because I’m going to start working toward my teaching certificate in January and that’ll be paid for by the University. This decision to pursue Secondary teaching is quite recent and I’m very excited about the prospect–I love to teach, but I also love my family/area and University teaching limits my options too much, but Secondary is a great gig–live where you want, write what you want, and making the teaching the focus of your teaching is what you’re supposed to do (not the publish or perish rubbish). So, I’m excited about this, but it means taking more financial hits in the short term.
I’m also eating more vegetarian–I’m trying the flexitarian route, that is, I’m not giving animal products up completely, but I’m trying to eat vegetarian most of the time–for health, for the environment, and for my wallet. For example, I have rice/beans with a variety of sauces and a side salad most days during the week for lunch–I can make this Sunday/Wednesday and it really fuels my work-outs better than say a deli sandwich or even salad/chicken would before. So, yes the cost and all the other reasons fueled the change, but I’ve found that its helpful in terms of trying to get a more steady exercise plan going as well. So many friends have joined this great CSA, but I’m single, so its just too much food for me–next year, they are offer a mini share, so I’m going to try that. I love going to the Farmer’s Market on Saturday mornings and I also belong to a food co-op, which is great.
For the woman who needed red-meat during her period, I’m not saying that you don’t–you know your body, but I would suggest (as a woman who is also chronically anemic) taking a multi-vitamin with iron in it daily and eating raisins, greens w/ walnut oil, and other iron rich foods before you period so that your need isn’t so pronounced. Paring greens with olive or walnut oil helps you body make useful the iron you’re receiving through your food. Its just a tip and I wish you well.
Amanda - unsolicited advice - don’t sell your pickup truck. Use it rarely, as you do, but keep it.
It would be cool to have one between a group of friends, just for hauling compost/moving furniture/taking dogs to the beach/etc. - they are so handy. A pickup truck co-op, if you will, in which the group shares maintenance and licensing, and pays for fuel as needed. Maybe you could form one?
I sold mine nearly 7 years ago and I still kick myself.
I have no solutions. I live with my boyfriend at the best halfway point between our jobs — 15 min commute for me, 20-40 for him (depending on traffic — he has to go through city traffic at rush hour, I don’t). There’s nothing I can safely walk or bike to, and the bus is really not a viable method of commuting (it would take 1.5 hours one way, not to mention being dangerous — people have been shot on that bus line recently).
I’m now seriously planning, when I get to the thesis-writing stage of my Ph.D and don’t need to go to the lab every day — to go ahead and sell the house a little ahead of schedule and move to an apartment where he can walk/bike to work. My driving in a couple days a week would be cheaper than both of us driving every day (because of the way the highways work, it would take me the same amount of time to commute from there as it takes him to commute from here).
The other option is for us to live separately. I’m not happy about that idea, and I know he really isn’t happy about it. But if gas prices keep going up, it might be our only option.
I already drive a small fuel-efficient car. My boyfriend still drives a big old boat because he’s saving up to replace it. He says he drops over $200/month on gas now. As gas prices go up, the math on car payment vs. gas prices might change (although he really hates the idea of buying a car in anything but cash).
The gas station near our house (the only thing I can walk to, ironically) put up prices by 5 cents yesterday, from $3.78 to $3.83, beating out the two expensive stations by campus (both $3.79 yesterday PM). I can’t wait to see what it is this morning. Especially because I need gas.
When I graduate I’m limiting my job search to cities where I can walk, bike, and/or use transit. My committee will probably grimace and tell me to “keep my options open” but I’m not going into academia anyway, and industry has better location choices.
Or maybe, just maybe, the car industry could make seats and seatbelts that AREN’T INHERENTLY UNSAFE for people between the ages of 4 and 10.
I mean, you are never going to get a seat that can accomodate an infant that can also accomodate an adult, safely. That’s fine. I get that. But when my kids were required to sit on “booster” seats… these are seats that are about two inches thick, to lift the kid up to where the seat belt will actually be protective. Concept of, maybe, having seat belts with a locking install mechanism that you can move their anchor to a location that’s safe for a kid? Hmm. Or, maybe, seats that lift up? We already have them in the front seat. Or, how about BRING BACK THE STATION WAGON. A longer, larger car will cost more in gasoline no matter what, but if its body-plan is a passenger car and it doesn’t have the height of a minivan or SUV, then it presents less wind resistance and also has less overall mass, and could be more easily hybridized.
It royally pisses me off that I *had* to get a minivan when I had three kids, even though my kids are quite skinny and the two older ones could have easily fit next to the baby’s car seat, because there was *also* a legal requirement that the older ones sit in booster seats… and I understand the requirement, I don’t want my kids to smash their collarbones in a car accident, but why are we putting the requirement on parents to buy extra equipment for their kids instead of, y’know, making the car safe for kids in the first place? “The seat belt is too high to be safe for children” is an absolutely bullshit reason to make parents buy more equipment. Make the car so that the seat belt can be *moved*. It would also be safer for and more comfortable for short adult people, who are disproportionately women. I know I always used to drive with a pillow under my butt until I bought a car where the driver’s seat adjusts up… and as a result on the rare occasions where I was a passenger the seat belt would hit me in the neck.
I mean, I’m screwed *now* because I have 4 kids, but 3 kids should not require an SUV or minivan. They’ll fit fine if they don’t need huge pieces of helper equipment.
Whoops! My italics tag got totally hosed. Let me try that again.
Say, are all those “pro-lifers” gonna start subsidizing families with 3+ kids who can’t use small, fuel efficient cars due to the need to use 3 car seats/boosters? Seriously! If you want us to have so many kids, you gotta make it affordable, right?
Or maybe, just maybe, the car industry could make seats and seatbelts that AREN’T INHERENTLY UNSAFE for people between the ages of 4 and 10.
I mean, you are never going to get a seat that can accomodate an infant that can also accomodate an adult, safely. That’s fine. I get that. But when my kids were required to sit on “booster” seats… these are seats that are about two inches thick, to lift the kid up to where the seat belt will actually be protective. Concept of, maybe, having seat belts with a locking install mechanism that you can move their anchor to a location that’s safe for a kid? Hmm. Or, maybe, seats that lift up? We already have them in the front seat. Or, how about BRING BACK THE STATION WAGON. A longer, larger car will cost more in gasoline no matter what, but if its body-plan is a passenger car and it doesn’t have the height of a minivan or SUV, then it presents less wind resistance and also has less overall mass, and could be more easily hybridized.
It royally pisses me off that I *had* to get a minivan when I had three kids, even though my kids are quite skinny and the two older ones could have easily fit next to the baby’s car seat, because there was *also* a legal requirement that the older ones sit in booster seats… and I understand the requirement, I don’t want my kids to smash their collarbones in a car accident, but why are we putting the requirement on parents to buy extra equipment for their kids instead of, y’know, making the car safe for kids in the first place? “The seat belt is too high to be safe for children” is an absolutely bullshit reason to make parents buy more equipment. Make the car so that the seat belt can be *moved*. It would also be safer for and more comfortable for short adult people, who are disproportionately women. I know I always used to drive with a pillow under my butt until I bought a car where the driver’s seat adjusts up… and as a result on the rare occasions where I was a passenger the seat belt would hit me in the neck.
I mean, I’m screwed now because I have 4 kids, but 3 kids should not require an SUV or minivan. They’ll fit fine if they don’t need huge pieces of helper equipment.
Caren, have you looked at Oak Park? It’s cheaper than any place we looked in Chicago, and we have not just one but two El lines (which is how I get to work when I’m not telecommuting). Lots of elementary schools within walking distance, lots of parents, and it’s blessedly integrated. All you have to do is ignore all the people who warn you away from the eastern (affordable) part of town because it is integrated and close to Austin.
I bicycle to work, 9 miles each way and it takes me 40 minutes or so, which is only 10-15 minutes more than if I drove (Seattle congestion). I do have a car (Hyundai Accent) but I only need to fill it once a month. I go grocery shopping 2-3 times a month and then I get 95% of what I need until next time in one go. Then I use the bike to go shopping for milk etc. during the week.
It’s because the poor English is combined with condescending, borderline irrelevant comments.
Tyro, do you mean Eric’s or squashed’s?
kimba is right. As a friend of mine says, “Never sell a musical instrument or a pickup truck.”
Being in a rural area, I’m very aware of how much the gas prices are going to impact everyone. You can’t get anywhere without driving. And the real burner is that this valley, like much of rural America, sprawled out over the last 25 years with a cavalier lack of planning that was completely predicated on cheap and abundant gasoline. Even people who want to switch to cycling now find the roads aren’t well suited to it. Even if the county suddenly decided to invest in public transportation, the routes would be extremely inefficient.
I work downtown, and I bought a house near downtown so that biking and walking would always be an option. Too many other people chose differently, and I just don’t know how to help them. I don’t feel the smug satisfaction of the Libertarian who feels he made superior choices. I made my choices, but I’m also incredibly lucky. And with the wide-ranging impact of high fuel prices, we’re all in the same boat. Individual strategies are important, but it’s high time for collective solutions.
Alara - when I analyzed the available information and decided to get a minivan, I found that most large “family” station wagons had worse mileage than comparable minivans. Why? Because the minivans are usually built on shorter-wheelbase compact-car platforms, while comperable wagons are based on mid-size platforms. So we just got the smallest minivan available (Mazda MPV), and it is actually a couple of inches shorter than a Mazda 6.
Minivans get vastly better mileage than SUVs with comparable seating capacity and cargo space. Few SUVs seat more than 5 passengers, and minivans are built from cars, not trucks. DO NOT mix the two up in a single “guzzler” category.
My dad just got a Mazda 5, which can seat 6 with all seats out, haul tons of stuff with all but the front seats down, but is otherwise a built-out Mazda 3 platform vehicle that gets 25-30mpg in mixed driving.
Amanda, re: your pickup. Have you looked into Austin CarShare (www.austincarshare.org). I think the carshare idea is fantasitc for city residents who might need a car occasionally, but don’t need one enough to justify car payments/insurance/parking/maintenance. They do seem to have both pickups and passenger cars — vehicle flexibility is another advantage over owning your own. From their website, it looks like they’re just getting off the ground in Austin, so their car locations might not match where you are or will be — in Philly, near where I live, there are probably a hundred locations, and you see Philly CarShare cars everywhere.
My wife and I have 2 kids (8 and 4 y.o.) and two cars — we both have to drive to work — she’s in a Prius, I’m in a American gas-guzzler. Neither of us can take public transit realistically, especially with kid drop-offs and pickups, although that’ll ease somewhat when the 4 y.o. starts kindergarten next year (they’ll be at the same school, about 5 blocks from our house. Thank. God.).
This is pretty much the new reality. Can anyone keep count of the many buckets of shit that have hit or are due to hit the fan (housing bust, food shortages, global warming, oil/energy prices, health insurance crisis, ongoing war, class war massacre against working people, trashing of civil and human rights, nuclear proliferation…)?
I am lucky. I can walk to work, the grocery store, movie theatre, bookstore, train station, and most of my friends’ houses. I don’t own a car, though I do have a ZipCar membership for when I need to haul something bulky/heavy or do a major grocery stock-up run.
I was planning to start applying to jobs in other cities, but now I am thinking that I won’t — because most places I’ve thought about going, I would need to own a car.
A comment on the vegetarian thing: I’ve long suspected that there are two poles of vegetarianism. If you try to replace meat with meat analogues and basically eat the way you did when you ate meat, yes, it will be more expensive. If you’re at the other pole and you cook from scratch using whole foods, it’s usually cheaper. I’ve been a vegetarian for 10 years, and I spent most of the first 6-7 years (admittedly, high school and college — not really culinary high points for anyone) at the first pole. So I understand the skepticism about “vegetarian is cheaper.” It only got cheaper for me when I stopped eating veggie burgers ($4-$5/box) and fake chicken strips and all that. I eat well for $30-$40 week, but I also cook a LOT (I like it, so I don’t consider it “work”), plan my meals pretty carefully, and have a well-stocked pantry. Every couple of months I make a “pantry run” for canned goods and such, spending about $50-$60. The fact that I’m the child of two parents who grew up poor (i.e., sometimes did not have enough to eat) and inherited their thrift and feel immense amounts of guilt when I spend a lot of money on food also helps.
Alara, car companies don’t even care about making cars safe for women! Why would they be concerned about children.
I remember when air bags first came out and suddenly car manufacturers were acting “shocked shocked!!” to find out people let their children ride in the front seat. Everyone knows the safest place has always been in the back! (Which is why even Maggie Simpson was shown with her car seat installed in the front. And why our old Chevy Blazer that only had a driver’s side air bag had a locking mechanism for child seats for the PASSENGER side.)
Airbags were designed to protect 5′7″ 200# men who were NOT WEARING THEIR SEATBELTS. Women could be injured by the force of the air bag if THEY SAT TOO CLOSE (why does the seat move up that far then!). How small was small? I was sure it was going to be those poor under 5 footers, but no, 5′4″ and under women were considered ‘too small’.
5′4″ is the AVERAGE AMERICAN WOMAN.
You can’t really expect a corporation to care designing cars to accommodate women and children now, can you? We all know it’s teh MENZ that buy the cars. And men like big cars that go fast–to hell with 55 mph speed limits and fuel efficiency. That’s for wusses!
——–Rob, thanks for the advice, but we are stuck in a subprime mortgage and got the boy into a magnet school this year. He finally adjusted, and we can’t just move him again. He’s brilliant, but immature and rotten at transitions. My husband and I often boggle at how expensive living in this city is. It hasn’t made sense to me in years. Where are all these millionaires coming from?
In Europe, gas prices are above $8 dollars a gallon last I looked. But for some reason they still manage to get around. You Americans have been spoiled for years. If you had had higher gas prices, manufacturers would have made more efficient cars that you would have bought.
You and your government dug your own grave. You have only yourselves to blame.
Some observations on walking to school:
My kids have preferred to walk 1km to their school for many years. This has less to do with being green per se than with getting exercise, fresh air, mimo/dido time, pet and wildlife contact time, arriving at school in a better frame of mind, and buses taking too much time.
For years we didn’t see anybody until we got within 1/4 to 1/3 of a mile, and even then we’d see kids getting on the bus.
This morning I saw three families who usually drive and wave as they go by. Only this time they were on foot, some with their dogs. In addition to the now growing downtown commuter bus crowd at the bus stop out front of the school, there are more people walking with their kids and hopping the local buses instead of driving.
I have to wonder if our breaking the “nobody walks from here” taboo for so long made it easier to not think it was too far or too crazy or otherwise not doable now that gas prices are insane (two of these families own the largest SUVs available!).
Nevermind that the most of the kids look extremely happy walking (lookit that bird!).
Bernarda, don’t assume that the US government represents the people. The term “military-industrial complex” dates back to President Eisenhower.
Thanks for your helpful suggestions, bernarda.
The stations don’t have the signs up telling you how to get around this?
The problem is that the credit networks have forbidden them to authorize more than $50/$75 per TRANSACTION. (Because when you’ve got one of those check card things that draws over the credit networks directly from your bank account, that’s ‘frozen’ money you can’t access until the authorization drops off the account–which can take several days.)
Once you’ve hit what they were allowed to authorize on that transaction, they stop the pump.
Swipe the card again, they are allowed to authorize another $50/$75 for the second transaction.
Hey Miguel - how are you?
We agree, the oil companies should get no subsidies or other corp welfare. Sell them the land where the oil is and let them go at. Where that’s not possible, auction off leasing rights.
Don’t blame me for this war, I was agin it.
Sure Alaska won’t make a difference. Live in a fantasy world. Whatever we extracted from there, we wouldn’t need from a bunch of dictators.
Nuclear. If France can do it, we can do it.
It’s not the oil companies or car companies job to “have our interests in mind” except to the extent they can sell us stuff. They, through their efforts, have allowed millions of people to drive wonderful vehicles billions of miles for years, at a price almost anyone who works can afford. They’ve done more for us (seeking profit) than all of the Senators combined, and there BS show trials in Washington - what a buncha crap - I know, you like it cause it reminds you of your commie brethren back in Russia.
bernarda May 22, 2008 at 10:39 am
In Europe, gas prices are above $8 dollars a gallon last I looked.
US problem is several folds:
1. Majority of cars has bad fuel economy
2. Urban structure and population density are not designed for efficiency. (It’s urban cowboy myth and faux crunchy culture.)
3. Mass transit is simply being neglected.
4. Iraq war is the dumbest thing ever. (Pentagon is the biggest buyer of diesel in the world. This affect trucking and farming…. hence food price.)
US has the worst fuel efficiency compared to all major industrial countries.
http://globalwarming.house.gov/tools/assets/files/0112.JPG
Libertarian, whatever fuel we extract from Alaska will go into the global oil market. It’s not like ExxonMobil is just going to route it directly from ANWR to the local Cenex. The market price and worldwide supply will still be primarily in the hands of a bunch of dictators.
Whatever we
extracted from theredon’t waste and don’t use, we wouldn’t need from a bunch of dictators.Fixed!
Laying waste to wildlands for a few drops of oil doesn’t solve the underlying problems with extreme inefficiencies of energy use in our economy.
Opening up Alaska will only open up the rights. Think about that for a second.
If you were an oil company and could go into a place and get the rights to drill oil there, does that mean you’d instantly start pumping? Have you even looked at the projections for the future price? If I owned oil rights, I wouldn’t drill today. Why should the oil companies?
Especially when our refineries are at capacity right now?
Opening up Alaska won’t make the dictators suffer much, won’t give us all we need, and really won’t make much of a difference in the long run aside from giving some oil companies the right to drill oil on public land. And with that right, they’ll sit on it until they can charge the public at the highest rate possible. That’s what they do. That’s how investors play.
Oh, and on the credit card limits/authorizations stuff . . . since Discover doesn’t participate in any of the check card (combination debit/credit card) crap, there should be no authorization limits if you’re using Discover (or AmEx). I know we’ve recently filled both our cars on a single Discover authorization (at $50/car).
Okay, for what I want to do . . . my biggest reason for running to the supermarket once weekly is veggies. I am going to try to use this to convince my husband to let me tear up part of the back yard for a bigger veggie garden. I also had some perennial groupings die off in my small perennial garden this winter and I’m thinking that those are the perfect spaces for a couple of broccoli plants.
If I plant more veggies, I need to learn to can them though.
We need to switch to the more efficient car for carpooling. Reason it’s more efficient though is that it’s manual and I am CRAP at driving a manual. So, driving the automatic has given us more choice–either I or the husband can keep the car during the day if it’s needed for anything work-wise for either of us. So, I either need to learn to drive stick better, or just give up on escaping the office during the day.
The Fed’s FOMC meeting minutes caused quite a stir in the currencies yesterday, so let’s go to the tape. The Fed noted that prior easing had provided a better balance to the risks to inflation and growth, although the risks were still towards downside growth. In addition, the Fed downgraded their outlook for growth and pointed toward higher inflation… In addition, the Fed noted that “much weaker 2008 growth, inflation to remain elevated in 2008, jobless rate to rise significantly
http://www.dailypfennig.com/currentIssue.aspx?date=5/22/2008
Just catching up on this thread and 3 thoughts occured to me (oh, I know you care!):
1) Jake Squid is correct about the stupidity of scrapping our rail system. Next time you see a freight train go by with all those double-stacked containers, think how many trucks that’s replacing (of course, at their destination they are hauled away by truck, but that’s not the same as long-hauling).
2) I was surprised that FlexCar/ZipCar wasn’t mentioned earlier in the thread. Have people not caught on, or not found it that useful in their own lives?
3) Bernarda, I have been saying for years, “We have it easy; in Europe gas is at least twice as much.” I know we don’t pay a realistic price for fuel, and that the current pain really just brings us more in line with world prices, so I don’t bitch about it. But I have also been saying for years, “Why won’t the damned government push the automakers to make more fuel-efficient cars, and fund exploration of alternative energy sources?” Plenty of our citizenry would love to take advantage of both, but our leaders are in bed with the oil industry. Too much money to be made, and if they don’t give us any options they don’t have to share with anyone.
Finally, the front page story on the local rag has a story saying that the dirty secret of ethanol–which Oregon law says must make up 10% of our gas, to make it burn cleaner–is that it’s less efficient. Apparently the claim was that it would be only a fraction less efficient, but there is a ton of anecdotal evidence that suggests otherwise. So people are frothing about that instead of the basic issue at hand. They feel like driving to Vancouver (Washington state) to gas up there, ethanol-free, is some kind of moral victory, or at least somehow sticking it to the man.
When the boy is a little older he’ll be able to walk to preschool (with supervision); that’ll cut a few bucks a week off the gas bill. If we use the lousy supermarket downtown, instead of the nice big one on top of a hill 7 miles away, that will cut another few bucks. And wood pellets (locally sourced) cost about half as much as heating oil, but the upfront cost is kinda serious.
One of the common factors all round is that serious savings require biggish upfront investments, and the consumer credit market is kinda screwed…
I’m taking the bus to work; we bought a hybrid way back in 2003 before we were all panicked. We’re also doing one vegetarian meal a week, at least until I can work another one into the menu planning. There’s a farmers market on Thursdays one block from my office. I am incredibly lucky.
I live in Austin, and I’ve been trying to figure out how to go car-less since I’ve moved here. The buses are ok, but not great. Also, I’m a musician — getting to and from a gig, late at night, with gear…public transporation becomes less do-able.
I would love to see Cap Metro increase the number of its bus lines, and the frequency of its buses. When it’s 100 degrees outside, waiting half an hour for a bus stops being inconvenient, and starts being dangerous. Public tranportation only works if people can take it all year round.
I think some meat eaters feel judged by just mentioning vegetarianism. It isn’t easy for everyone. It took me two years to go veg and another year to go vegan and that was with the help of my vegan friends on speed dial.
It has saved me a bundle, though. I’ve started buying dried beans to cook on the weekends or checking circulars for sales when I have time. A lot of tips for spending less at the store require lots of time, effort, or planning so you have to weigh the convenience over price.
Most people I know don’t have time to watch a pot boil for hours. That’s why the lower class is affected so much more by these costs. When you work an eight to sixteen-hour shift, who wants to spend an hour chopping veggies or a separating a whole chicken? Sure, it may cost less, but sleep vs. convenience is an issue. That’s where non-nutritious options like ramen come in.
Plus, many people are raised to believe that meat is the most efficient way to get nutrients. they’d rather spend 20 minutes cooking ground beef than 20 minutes making quinoa if time is precious. Also, learning about alternative sources of protein is a privilege in and of itself.
I don’t have an answer, just saying…
I’ve also started buying in bulk with a friend. We split some of the costs. I can buy two half gallons of soy milk for $6 or 3 gallons for $10 at Costco. This option works if you have storage for such things, which many of us are lacking as housing rises. Aiya.
As soon as I learn to bike in traffic without fearing for my life, I’ll probably bike to work.
On the topic of getting locally grown food to try to cut down rising prices, here’s a post from Mike the Mad Biologist over at ScienceBlogs.
http://scienceblogs.com/mikethemadbiologist/2008/05/skyscrapers_as_farms_skyfarmin.php
The accompanying article is mostly talking about food shortages and fighting global warming by allowing a lot of farmland to basically go forest again, but I see this as a big part of the problem of all the fuel that is used bringing large quantities of food into cities. I hope this works out and gets implemented.
On the topic of getting locally grown food to try to cut down rising prices, here’s a post from Mike the Mad Biologist over at ScienceBlogs.
http://scienceblogs.com/mikethemadbiologist/2008/05/skyscrapers_as_farms_skyfarmin.php
The accompanying article is mostly talking about food shortages and fighting global warming by allowing a lot of farmland to basically go forest again, but I see this as a big part of the problem of all the fuel that is used bringing large quantities of food into cities. I hope this works out and gets implemented.
My biggest goal for food cost efficiency over the next year or so is to start canning, or at least learn more about how to preserve fresh foods easily (I’m a little paranoid about messing up the canning and giving myself botulism). What can be frozen, and what’s the best way to do so? How long will that keep? Etc.
Also, someone above talked about wanting to join a CSA but being single and thus getting way too much food — I had the same problem until I pulled some jedi mind tricks and convinced my roommate to go in with me. Do you have a friend who would split the share with you?