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	<title>Comments on: No child left in school</title>
	<link>http://pandagon.blogsome.com/2008/04/07/7013/</link>
	<description>Just another WordPress weblog</description>
	<pubDate>Mon, 09 Nov 2009 15:45:17 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>by: PinkyLeftBrain</title>
		<link>http://pandagon.blogsome.com/2008/04/07/7013/#comment-507058</link>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Apr 2008 19:30:26 +0100</pubDate>
		<guid>http://pandagon.blogsome.com/2008/04/07/7013/#comment-507058</guid>
					<description>With articles and controversies like this, is it any wonder kids drop out?

&lt;blockquote&gt;High School Textbook Under Fire
By The Associated Press Associated Press Writer

Apr 8th, 2008 | Excerpts being criticized from the 10th edition of the textbook &quot;American Government&quot; by James Wilson and John Dilulio:

—&quot;Science doesn't know whether we are experiencing a dangerous level of global warming or how bad the greenhouse effect is, if it exists at all.&quot;

—&quot;Since 1947, the (U.S. Supreme) Court has applied the wall-of-separation theory to strike down as unconstitutional every effort to have any form of prayer in public schools, even if it is nonsectarian, voluntary or limited to reading a passage of the Bible.&quot;

—&quot;The (2003 Lawrence v. Texas) decision had a benefit and a cost. The benefit was to strike down a law that was rarely enforced and if introduced today probably could not be passed. The cost was to create the possibility that the Court, and not Congress or state legislatures, might decide whether same-sex marriages were legal.

———

Source: &quot;American Government&quot; by James Wilson and John Dilulio.&lt;/blockquote&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>With articles and controversies like this, is it any wonder kids drop out?</p>
	<blockquote><p>High School Textbook Under Fire<br />
By The Associated Press Associated Press Writer</p>
	<p>Apr 8th, 2008 | Excerpts being criticized from the 10th edition of the textbook &#8220;American Government&#8221; by James Wilson and John Dilulio:</p>
	<p>—&#8221;Science doesn&#8217;t know whether we are experiencing a dangerous level of global warming or how bad the greenhouse effect is, if it exists at all.&#8221;</p>
	<p>—&#8221;Since 1947, the (U.S. Supreme) Court has applied the wall-of-separation theory to strike down as unconstitutional every effort to have any form of prayer in public schools, even if it is nonsectarian, voluntary or limited to reading a passage of the Bible.&#8221;</p>
	<p>—&#8221;The (2003 Lawrence v. Texas) decision had a benefit and a cost. The benefit was to strike down a law that was rarely enforced and if introduced today probably could not be passed. The cost was to create the possibility that the Court, and not Congress or state legislatures, might decide whether same-sex marriages were legal.</p>
	<p>———</p>
	<p>Source: &#8220;American Government&#8221; by James Wilson and John Dilulio.</p></blockquote>
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		<title>by: Hawise, Dame of Deep Fried</title>
		<link>http://pandagon.blogsome.com/2008/04/07/7013/#comment-506949</link>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Apr 2008 13:35:48 +0100</pubDate>
		<guid>http://pandagon.blogsome.com/2008/04/07/7013/#comment-506949</guid>
					<description>Sorry for the double post, my bad.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>Sorry for the double post, my bad.
</p>
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		<title>by: Mark Foxwell</title>
		<link>http://pandagon.blogsome.com/2008/04/07/7013/#comment-506946</link>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Apr 2008 13:28:26 +0100</pubDate>
		<guid>http://pandagon.blogsome.com/2008/04/07/7013/#comment-506946</guid>
					<description>If my break weren't ending right now, I'd share my own experiences with NCLB.

Let me just say this--my skepticism about the USA having the political and social will to provide &lt;em&gt;good&lt;/em&gt; K-12 education is based on my disillusionment &lt;em&gt;before&lt;/em&gt; NCLB and the associated testing mainia even took effect.

I agree it has only gotten worse since then.

KTHNXBYE for now...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>If my break weren&#8217;t ending right now, I&#8217;d share my own experiences with NCLB.</p>
	<p>Let me just say this&#8211;my skepticism about the USA having the political and social will to provide <em>good</em> K-12 education is based on my disillusionment <em>before</em> NCLB and the associated testing mainia even took effect.</p>
	<p>I agree it has only gotten worse since then.</p>
	<p>KTHNXBYE for now&#8230;
</p>
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		<title>by: Hawise, Dame of Deep Fried</title>
		<link>http://pandagon.blogsome.com/2008/04/07/7013/#comment-506901</link>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Apr 2008 10:27:29 +0100</pubDate>
		<guid>http://pandagon.blogsome.com/2008/04/07/7013/#comment-506901</guid>
					<description>Ms. Kate- I'm saying that we make a lot of choices in our teens and twenties that we may change in our thirties and forties, a solid base education lets us make changes. Ultimately we have to base our lives on what works for us and not some dreamy societal goal. The systems that we put into place need to be based on the idea that we get the most people to the greatest number of options and then we leave the choices up to them. Much of current education policy is based on limiting options as too dangerous, bad for society or, my favorite- not appropriate, with what is appropriate undefined. 

It is appropriate for someone to want to attain an advanced degree and to be given every chance to gain that degree, it is equally appropriate for them to decide after they have it that they would be happier doing something else. It is equally appropriate for someone to decide that they don't want an advanced degree but want the option to gain it at a later date.  The education is never wasted, it is simply applied in a different context.  Going for an education system that opens everyone's options up is very expensive, the only thing more expensive is NOT doing it. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>Ms. Kate- I&#8217;m saying that we make a lot of choices in our teens and twenties that we may change in our thirties and forties, a solid base education lets us make changes. Ultimately we have to base our lives on what works for us and not some dreamy societal goal. The systems that we put into place need to be based on the idea that we get the most people to the greatest number of options and then we leave the choices up to them. Much of current education policy is based on limiting options as too dangerous, bad for society or, my favorite- not appropriate, with what is appropriate undefined. </p>
	<p>It is appropriate for someone to want to attain an advanced degree and to be given every chance to gain that degree, it is equally appropriate for them to decide after they have it that they would be happier doing something else. It is equally appropriate for someone to decide that they don&#8217;t want an advanced degree but want the option to gain it at a later date.  The education is never wasted, it is simply applied in a different context.  Going for an education system that opens everyone&#8217;s options up is very expensive, the only thing more expensive is NOT doing it.
</p>
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		<title>by: Hawise, Dame of Deep Fried</title>
		<link>http://pandagon.blogsome.com/2008/04/07/7013/#comment-506900</link>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Apr 2008 10:24:50 +0100</pubDate>
		<guid>http://pandagon.blogsome.com/2008/04/07/7013/#comment-506900</guid>
					<description>Ms. Kate- I'm saying that we make a lot of choices in our teens and twenties that we may change in our thirties and forties, a solid base education lets us make changes. Ultimately we have to base our lives on what works for us and not some dreamy societal goal. The systems that we put into place need to be based on the idea that we get the most people to the greatest number of options and then we leave the choices up to them. Much of current education policy is based on limiting options as too dangerous, bad for society or, my favorite- not appropriate, with what is appropriate undefined. 

It is appropriate for someone to want to attain an advanced degree and to be given every chance to gain that degree, it is equally appropriate for them to decide after they have it that they would be happier doing something else. It is equally appropriate for someone to decide that they don't want an advanced degree but want the option to gain it at a later date.  The education is never wasted, it is simply applied in a different context.  Going for an education system that opens everyone's options up is very expensive, the only thing more expensive is NOT doing it. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>Ms. Kate- I&#8217;m saying that we make a lot of choices in our teens and twenties that we may change in our thirties and forties, a solid base education lets us make changes. Ultimately we have to base our lives on what works for us and not some dreamy societal goal. The systems that we put into place need to be based on the idea that we get the most people to the greatest number of options and then we leave the choices up to them. Much of current education policy is based on limiting options as too dangerous, bad for society or, my favorite- not appropriate, with what is appropriate undefined. </p>
	<p>It is appropriate for someone to want to attain an advanced degree and to be given every chance to gain that degree, it is equally appropriate for them to decide after they have it that they would be happier doing something else. It is equally appropriate for someone to decide that they don&#8217;t want an advanced degree but want the option to gain it at a later date.  The education is never wasted, it is simply applied in a different context.  Going for an education system that opens everyone&#8217;s options up is very expensive, the only thing more expensive is NOT doing it.
</p>
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		<title>by: Ms Kate</title>
		<link>http://pandagon.blogsome.com/2008/04/07/7013/#comment-506879</link>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Apr 2008 08:28:59 +0100</pubDate>
		<guid>http://pandagon.blogsome.com/2008/04/07/7013/#comment-506879</guid>
					<description>Hawise, the guy who did the carpentry in our kitchen has an advanced physics degree.  His carpenter wife has an advanced mathematics degree.

You were saying?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>Hawise, the guy who did the carpentry in our kitchen has an advanced physics degree.  His carpenter wife has an advanced mathematics degree.</p>
	<p>You were saying?
</p>
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		<title>by: PinkyLeftBrain</title>
		<link>http://pandagon.blogsome.com/2008/04/07/7013/#comment-506878</link>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Apr 2008 08:12:34 +0100</pubDate>
		<guid>http://pandagon.blogsome.com/2008/04/07/7013/#comment-506878</guid>
					<description>I worked with the first browser. I remember when 14.4 was fast for dialup.

I fell in love with Lisa.

The Apple Lisa.

I've seen so much and am glad to have been a part of it. But 'Now watch this drive' Bush and his unpatriotic 'base' have decimated the industry and this country. I have a better chance of getting hired in India as a native than I do here. (Or in China)

Ahh the time we live in... The future so uncertain.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>I worked with the first browser. I remember when 14.4 was fast for dialup.</p>
	<p>I fell in love with Lisa.</p>
	<p>The Apple Lisa.</p>
	<p>I&#8217;ve seen so much and am glad to have been a part of it. But &#8216;Now watch this drive&#8217; Bush and his unpatriotic &#8216;base&#8217; have decimated the industry and this country. I have a better chance of getting hired in India as a native than I do here. (Or in China)</p>
	<p>Ahh the time we live in&#8230; The future so uncertain.
</p>
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		<title>by: PinkyLeftBrain</title>
		<link>http://pandagon.blogsome.com/2008/04/07/7013/#comment-506877</link>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Apr 2008 08:07:02 +0100</pubDate>
		<guid>http://pandagon.blogsome.com/2008/04/07/7013/#comment-506877</guid>
					<description>Wow that came out harsher than I thought.

But there were kids that could 'milk the system'.

I often wonder what about them allowed them to succeed in that environment. Most were from more well to do families but there were some that weren't.

I really think that it's the family structure that they come from and return to. I feared school just about as much as being at home. I was constantly picked on and beaten at home and school. My psyche was so battered as a child. (Did I mention that I was an 'Army-brat'? Yet another generation of victims of Bush's war is being bred right now at this very minute. A whole host of silent victims of the war on democracy.)

I can't fault my past for the future and have tried hard to get past it. And this is turning out to get too close to the bone but suffice it to say that the reason why American education sucks has a multitude of reasons. Yes tenure plays a role but so does the familial stress and home life. My therapy was getting a motorcycle in high school. Escapism takes many forms. Pre-mix fumes and chain lube stench coupled with bugs in my teeth and dirt in my ears was what kept me sane in the insane world I knew. Thank you Mr. Suzuki!

And people wonder why I laugh when they talk about public education being no place to have sex ed. HAH!!!

'Have a nice day'</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>Wow that came out harsher than I thought.</p>
	<p>But there were kids that could &#8216;milk the system&#8217;.</p>
	<p>I often wonder what about them allowed them to succeed in that environment. Most were from more well to do families but there were some that weren&#8217;t.</p>
	<p>I really think that it&#8217;s the family structure that they come from and return to. I feared school just about as much as being at home. I was constantly picked on and beaten at home and school. My psyche was so battered as a child. (Did I mention that I was an &#8216;Army-brat&#8217;? Yet another generation of victims of Bush&#8217;s war is being bred right now at this very minute. A whole host of silent victims of the war on democracy.)</p>
	<p>I can&#8217;t fault my past for the future and have tried hard to get past it. And this is turning out to get too close to the bone but suffice it to say that the reason why American education sucks has a multitude of reasons. Yes tenure plays a role but so does the familial stress and home life. My therapy was getting a motorcycle in high school. Escapism takes many forms. Pre-mix fumes and chain lube stench coupled with bugs in my teeth and dirt in my ears was what kept me sane in the insane world I knew. Thank you Mr. Suzuki!</p>
	<p>And people wonder why I laugh when they talk about public education being no place to have sex ed. HAH!!!</p>
	<p>&#8216;Have a nice day&#8217;
</p>
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		<title>by: Hawise, Dame of Deep Fried</title>
		<link>http://pandagon.blogsome.com/2008/04/07/7013/#comment-506876</link>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Apr 2008 08:05:40 +0100</pubDate>
		<guid>http://pandagon.blogsome.com/2008/04/07/7013/#comment-506876</guid>
					<description>the opoponax
April 7, 2008 at 5:09 pm 

Since when do people with J.D.’s commonly find themselves wishing they had some sort of trade skills to fall back on? 


I don't know how common it is but I know three.  One was pushed by his family to get his law degree, they worked long hours and sacrificed and after he made it, he found that the stress was killing him.  He is now a mason like his father and his grandfather.  Another was in corporate tax law and the hours were excruciating.  To get time with his family he opted to go back to school and become a teacher.  A third is now a plumber after he realized that he simply wasn't cut out for the culture of a law office. 

Not everyone is ideal for every job and school should be structured to present ALL students with as many options as possible. It is bad enough that media presents wildly skewed views of 'popular/successful/high paying' careers without schools doing the same thing. This is part of what leads to NCLB type legislation, the belief at the highest level that if you aren't going to make it as a lawyer/doctor/CEO then why bother educating you in the first place.  Sink or swim with the definition of what it means to swim be Olympic gold medalist.  
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>the opoponax<br />
April 7, 2008 at 5:09 pm </p>
	<p>Since when do people with J.D.’s commonly find themselves wishing they had some sort of trade skills to fall back on? </p>
	<p>I don&#8217;t know how common it is but I know three.  One was pushed by his family to get his law degree, they worked long hours and sacrificed and after he made it, he found that the stress was killing him.  He is now a mason like his father and his grandfather.  Another was in corporate tax law and the hours were excruciating.  To get time with his family he opted to go back to school and become a teacher.  A third is now a plumber after he realized that he simply wasn&#8217;t cut out for the culture of a law office. </p>
	<p>Not everyone is ideal for every job and school should be structured to present ALL students with as many options as possible. It is bad enough that media presents wildly skewed views of &#8216;popular/successful/high paying&#8217; careers without schools doing the same thing. This is part of what leads to NCLB type legislation, the belief at the highest level that if you aren&#8217;t going to make it as a lawyer/doctor/CEO then why bother educating you in the first place.  Sink or swim with the definition of what it means to swim be Olympic gold medalist.
</p>
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		<title>by: MikeEss</title>
		<link>http://pandagon.blogsome.com/2008/04/07/7013/#comment-506875</link>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Apr 2008 08:04:44 +0100</pubDate>
		<guid>http://pandagon.blogsome.com/2008/04/07/7013/#comment-506875</guid>
					<description>&lt;i&gt;&quot;Anyone want to hire a late 40’s computer expert?&quot;&lt;/i&gt;

Pinky, you mean you're an expert in computers based on  vacuum-tubes and relays with hand wiring for programming?  Really?... :)

As another IT guy in his late 40's, I know exactly what you mean.  Sometimes it feels like I must be old enough to have known &lt;a href=&quot;http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Babbage&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Charles Babbage&lt;/a&gt; personally.

IT is not kind to those who get old without moving to upper management.  The job landscape gets pretty barren for those of us with gray hair...

Good luck with your quest.  And know there are many more of us out here in the same aged and leaking boat... </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p><i>&#8220;Anyone want to hire a late 40’s computer expert?&#8221;</i></p>
	<p>Pinky, you mean you&#8217;re an expert in computers based on  vacuum-tubes and relays with hand wiring for programming?  Really?&#8230; <img src='http://pandagon.blogsome.com/wp-images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
	<p>As another IT guy in his late 40&#8217;s, I know exactly what you mean.  Sometimes it feels like I must be old enough to have known <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Babbage" rel="nofollow">Charles Babbage</a> personally.</p>
	<p>IT is not kind to those who get old without moving to upper management.  The job landscape gets pretty barren for those of us with gray hair&#8230;</p>
	<p>Good luck with your quest.  And know there are many more of us out here in the same aged and leaking boat&#8230;
</p>
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