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	<title>Comments on: Malkin, Racial Profiling, and the Jena 6</title>
	<link>http://pandagon.blogsome.com/2007/09/24/malkin-racial-profiling-and-the-jena-6/</link>
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	<pubDate>Mon, 09 Nov 2009 20:22:20 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>by: Chrissy</title>
		<link>http://pandagon.blogsome.com/2007/09/24/malkin-racial-profiling-and-the-jena-6/#comment-453302</link>
		<pubDate>Tue, 25 Sep 2007 21:12:00 +0100</pubDate>
		<guid>http://pandagon.blogsome.com/2007/09/24/malkin-racial-profiling-and-the-jena-6/#comment-453302</guid>
					<description>Sean,
You've totally got your head buried in the sand, or up your behind.  First off, this was an in-school brawl.  Most in-school brawls end in, at most, disciplinary actions by the school.  This in-school brawl, a fight where the deadly weapon of Air Jordans (not a gun, baseball bat, razor blade, or even a lunch tray) were used to visit a full 2 hour headache on another student, ended in attempted murder charges.  You are free to keep your head up your ass and say these results are justified in light of the circumstances.  Do you honestly believe that the students in questions were either trying or could have been trying to kill their classmate?  Intent is an element of that crime.  Or do you think they just wanted him to STFU?  I would guess the latter.  You can pretend like every single in-school brawl ends at the police station and results in jail sentences, but that is not the reality of how these situations are dealt with.  

The fact that the student who got his ass whooped was looking for an ass-whooping goes without saying.  But justice being done does not mean, and has never meant locking up a kid for 100 years for making a mistake!  Then wonder why so many of our tax dollars are being sunk into the Prison Industrial Complex hell on earth we are so quick to ship little 16 year olds who kicked a kid once in a fight.  I'm not even sure I would want any tax dollars to go to getting this &quot;victim&quot; justice at all.  It should have been resolved within the school, with some suspensions or perhaps, if these kids records were riddled with offenses, removing the kids to an alternative school.
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>Sean,<br />
You&#8217;ve totally got your head buried in the sand, or up your behind.  First off, this was an in-school brawl.  Most in-school brawls end in, at most, disciplinary actions by the school.  This in-school brawl, a fight where the deadly weapon of Air Jordans (not a gun, baseball bat, razor blade, or even a lunch tray) were used to visit a full 2 hour headache on another student, ended in attempted murder charges.  You are free to keep your head up your ass and say these results are justified in light of the circumstances.  Do you honestly believe that the students in questions were either trying or could have been trying to kill their classmate?  Intent is an element of that crime.  Or do you think they just wanted him to STFU?  I would guess the latter.  You can pretend like every single in-school brawl ends at the police station and results in jail sentences, but that is not the reality of how these situations are dealt with.  </p>
	<p>The fact that the student who got his ass whooped was looking for an ass-whooping goes without saying.  But justice being done does not mean, and has never meant locking up a kid for 100 years for making a mistake!  Then wonder why so many of our tax dollars are being sunk into the Prison Industrial Complex hell on earth we are so quick to ship little 16 year olds who kicked a kid once in a fight.  I&#8217;m not even sure I would want any tax dollars to go to getting this &#8220;victim&#8221; justice at all.  It should have been resolved within the school, with some suspensions or perhaps, if these kids records were riddled with offenses, removing the kids to an alternative school.
</p>
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		<title>by: Terry Karney (Demi-urge of Cutlery)</title>
		<link>http://pandagon.blogsome.com/2007/09/24/malkin-racial-profiling-and-the-jena-6/#comment-453279</link>
		<pubDate>Tue, 25 Sep 2007 18:49:37 +0100</pubDate>
		<guid>http://pandagon.blogsome.com/2007/09/24/malkin-racial-profiling-and-the-jena-6/#comment-453279</guid>
					<description>Sean:  The issue isn't that what they did was illegal, but that the charges are so out of proportion for the actual incident.

Assault and Battery, even Aggravated Assault sure.

There are mitigating circumstances; which could affect sentencing, but the actual charges are attempted murder.

It's disproportionate, esp. as previous events (like the incident with a gun) were ignored/papered over.

So it's disporportionate, twice.

(p.s.  By the time I get to the bottom of an entry and comments, I've timed out the catchpa, which is frustrating).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>Sean:  The issue isn&#8217;t that what they did was illegal, but that the charges are so out of proportion for the actual incident.</p>
	<p>Assault and Battery, even Aggravated Assault sure.</p>
	<p>There are mitigating circumstances; which could affect sentencing, but the actual charges are attempted murder.</p>
	<p>It&#8217;s disproportionate, esp. as previous events (like the incident with a gun) were ignored/papered over.</p>
	<p>So it&#8217;s disporportionate, twice.</p>
	<p>(p.s.  By the time I get to the bottom of an entry and comments, I&#8217;ve timed out the catchpa, which is frustrating).
</p>
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		<title>by: J.B.</title>
		<link>http://pandagon.blogsome.com/2007/09/24/malkin-racial-profiling-and-the-jena-6/#comment-453249</link>
		<pubDate>Tue, 25 Sep 2007 16:42:58 +0100</pubDate>
		<guid>http://pandagon.blogsome.com/2007/09/24/malkin-racial-profiling-and-the-jena-6/#comment-453249</guid>
					<description>I just want to say something about that concept that lynchings happened &quot;along time ago&quot; so they shouldn't have any impact anymore.  I was living in Durham NC when the book &quot;Blood Done Sign my Name&quot; came out about a lynching and subsequent race riot in the 70s in Oxford NC.  Well, I was teaching in Oxford when I heard the review of the book on NPR and I was surprised that there was a book getting national attention about this itty bitty town.  So I asked people about it.  The people who did the killings are all still there.  Everyone knows them.  Their son went to the school I taught at (and was known for making trouble with the Mexican students).  The grandson of the man who had led the riots was in my class.  35 years is by no means the distant past, especially in a small town where everyone knows everyone.   Everyone knows that a black man was killed and no one served a day in jail for it even though everyone in the town had no doubt who killed him.  I can't even imagine how my students would have reacted if someone hung nooses in the school.  Lynchings may seem like ancient history to those of us who aren't from the South, just something you read about in a history book, but they are still a pretty fresh memory to those who lived through them.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>I just want to say something about that concept that lynchings happened &#8220;along time ago&#8221; so they shouldn&#8217;t have any impact anymore.  I was living in Durham NC when the book &#8220;Blood Done Sign my Name&#8221; came out about a lynching and subsequent race riot in the 70s in Oxford NC.  Well, I was teaching in Oxford when I heard the review of the book on NPR and I was surprised that there was a book getting national attention about this itty bitty town.  So I asked people about it.  The people who did the killings are all still there.  Everyone knows them.  Their son went to the school I taught at (and was known for making trouble with the Mexican students).  The grandson of the man who had led the riots was in my class.  35 years is by no means the distant past, especially in a small town where everyone knows everyone.   Everyone knows that a black man was killed and no one served a day in jail for it even though everyone in the town had no doubt who killed him.  I can&#8217;t even imagine how my students would have reacted if someone hung nooses in the school.  Lynchings may seem like ancient history to those of us who aren&#8217;t from the South, just something you read about in a history book, but they are still a pretty fresh memory to those who lived through them.
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		<title>by: Decnavda</title>
		<link>http://pandagon.blogsome.com/2007/09/24/malkin-racial-profiling-and-the-jena-6/#comment-453217</link>
		<pubDate>Tue, 25 Sep 2007 14:42:18 +0100</pubDate>
		<guid>http://pandagon.blogsome.com/2007/09/24/malkin-racial-profiling-and-the-jena-6/#comment-453217</guid>
					<description>I also agree with tinfoil hattie, and would just like to point out that the comment was egregiously misogynist in a very specifically racist way, as well.

It does us no good to descend to level of our opponents.  It just portrays us as hypocrits.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>I also agree with tinfoil hattie, and would just like to point out that the comment was egregiously misogynist in a very specifically racist way, as well.</p>
	<p>It does us no good to descend to level of our opponents.  It just portrays us as hypocrits.
</p>
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		<title>by: Sean</title>
		<link>http://pandagon.blogsome.com/2007/09/24/malkin-racial-profiling-and-the-jena-6/#comment-453212</link>
		<pubDate>Tue, 25 Sep 2007 14:31:07 +0100</pubDate>
		<guid>http://pandagon.blogsome.com/2007/09/24/malkin-racial-profiling-and-the-jena-6/#comment-453212</guid>
					<description>Even if you are right, and the beating was incited by racism (I'm not arguing that it wasn't a large part of it), why does that absolve the &quot;Jena 6&quot; of the criminal responsibilities for the act?  

Why should the beating of anyone be tolerated, regardless of reason?

It seems to me that the running commentary from many on the left is that &lt;b&gt;because&lt;/b&gt; the Jena 6 were black, and &lt;b&gt;because&lt;/b&gt; the victim of their assault was white, and &lt;b&gt;because&lt;/b&gt; whites in Jena are evil racists, therefore, the beating &lt;b&gt;wasn't their fault&lt;/b&gt;.

Am I missing something here?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>Even if you are right, and the beating was incited by racism (I&#8217;m not arguing that it wasn&#8217;t a large part of it), why does that absolve the &#8220;Jena 6&#8243; of the criminal responsibilities for the act?  </p>
	<p>Why should the beating of anyone be tolerated, regardless of reason?</p>
	<p>It seems to me that the running commentary from many on the left is that <b>because</b> the Jena 6 were black, and <b>because</b> the victim of their assault was white, and <b>because</b> whites in Jena are evil racists, therefore, the beating <b>wasn&#8217;t their fault</b>.</p>
	<p>Am I missing something here?
</p>
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		<title>by: Justin</title>
		<link>http://pandagon.blogsome.com/2007/09/24/malkin-racial-profiling-and-the-jena-6/#comment-453206</link>
		<pubDate>Tue, 25 Sep 2007 14:18:36 +0100</pubDate>
		<guid>http://pandagon.blogsome.com/2007/09/24/malkin-racial-profiling-and-the-jena-6/#comment-453206</guid>
					<description>Tinfoil Hattie,
I love you.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>Tinfoil Hattie,<br />
I love you.
</p>
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		<title>by: raging red</title>
		<link>http://pandagon.blogsome.com/2007/09/24/malkin-racial-profiling-and-the-jena-6/#comment-453185</link>
		<pubDate>Tue, 25 Sep 2007 13:14:42 +0100</pubDate>
		<guid>http://pandagon.blogsome.com/2007/09/24/malkin-racial-profiling-and-the-jena-6/#comment-453185</guid>
					<description>&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.local10.com/news/14199127/detail.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;And other one.&lt;/a&gt;  This time they &lt;i&gt;were&lt;/i&gt; charged with a hate crime.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p><a href="http://www.local10.com/news/14199127/detail.html" rel="nofollow">And other one.</a>  This time they <i>were</i> charged with a hate crime.
</p>
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		<title>by: Samantha Vimes</title>
		<link>http://pandagon.blogsome.com/2007/09/24/malkin-racial-profiling-and-the-jena-6/#comment-453101</link>
		<pubDate>Tue, 25 Sep 2007 07:06:14 +0100</pubDate>
		<guid>http://pandagon.blogsome.com/2007/09/24/malkin-racial-profiling-and-the-jena-6/#comment-453101</guid>
					<description>Re: The Jena 6

I keep remembering a rather long thread we had about a year ago, about bullies, our school days, and how we responded. 

Time after time, story after story, the only thing that ever made a difference, in most cases, was for the perps to have fear put in them. Mostly, the bullying victim snapped, and attacked, at least momentarily, enough for the bullies never to want to see that happen again. One other person had seen the bullies find fear when they'd knocked their victim downstairs, only to see a group of teachers at the bottom of the stairs glaring up at them. 

Which leads me to think there was only 2 ways the violence against the blacks would stop escalating. Like the kids who found the teachers spotting them nearly red-handed, the racists would have sat on their hate if they had been stopped by authority when the trouble started. Since no one in authority would help the black kids, though, showing they would fight back was about the only option left. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>Re: The Jena 6</p>
	<p>I keep remembering a rather long thread we had about a year ago, about bullies, our school days, and how we responded. </p>
	<p>Time after time, story after story, the only thing that ever made a difference, in most cases, was for the perps to have fear put in them. Mostly, the bullying victim snapped, and attacked, at least momentarily, enough for the bullies never to want to see that happen again. One other person had seen the bullies find fear when they&#8217;d knocked their victim downstairs, only to see a group of teachers at the bottom of the stairs glaring up at them. </p>
	<p>Which leads me to think there was only 2 ways the violence against the blacks would stop escalating. Like the kids who found the teachers spotting them nearly red-handed, the racists would have sat on their hate if they had been stopped by authority when the trouble started. Since no one in authority would help the black kids, though, showing they would fight back was about the only option left.
</p>
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		<title>by: raging red</title>
		<link>http://pandagon.blogsome.com/2007/09/24/malkin-racial-profiling-and-the-jena-6/#comment-453049</link>
		<pubDate>Tue, 25 Sep 2007 00:50:09 +0100</pubDate>
		<guid>http://pandagon.blogsome.com/2007/09/24/malkin-racial-profiling-and-the-jena-6/#comment-453049</guid>
					<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;I’d need a West Virginian to tell us, but I don’t think they have the kind of hate-crimes statute that we have in California where it can be used to tack a few extra years onto your sentence.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Mnemosyne, the WV hate crimes statute can be used two ways -- as a separate charge that carries a maximum 10 year sentence or as an aggravating circumstance at sentencing for other crimes.  So, even though the prosecutor hasn't charged them with hate crimes, the question of whether the crime was motivated by racial bias will most likely come up at sentencing and could increase their sentences.  Of course, if they're convicted of kidnapping, they could get life sentences anyway.

And the prosecutor has not said that he's ruled out filing hate crime charges, so as you say, it is possible that he's keeping them in his back pocket, though as cynical as I can be about the justice system, I don't really have any doubt that these people are going to get what they deserve.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<blockquote><p>I’d need a West Virginian to tell us, but I don’t think they have the kind of hate-crimes statute that we have in California where it can be used to tack a few extra years onto your sentence.</p></blockquote>
	<p>Mnemosyne, the WV hate crimes statute can be used two ways &#8212; as a separate charge that carries a maximum 10 year sentence or as an aggravating circumstance at sentencing for other crimes.  So, even though the prosecutor hasn&#8217;t charged them with hate crimes, the question of whether the crime was motivated by racial bias will most likely come up at sentencing and could increase their sentences.  Of course, if they&#8217;re convicted of kidnapping, they could get life sentences anyway.</p>
	<p>And the prosecutor has not said that he&#8217;s ruled out filing hate crime charges, so as you say, it is possible that he&#8217;s keeping them in his back pocket, though as cynical as I can be about the justice system, I don&#8217;t really have any doubt that these people are going to get what they deserve.
</p>
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		<title>by: hf</title>
		<link>http://pandagon.blogsome.com/2007/09/24/malkin-racial-profiling-and-the-jena-6/#comment-453000</link>
		<pubDate>Mon, 24 Sep 2007 22:40:00 +0100</pubDate>
		<guid>http://pandagon.blogsome.com/2007/09/24/malkin-racial-profiling-and-the-jena-6/#comment-453000</guid>
					<description>&lt;i&gt;If it’s only logical to target members of the same race or religion when the threat is felt from simply that race and religion, then it’s logical for blacks, faced with nooses and shotguns in an atmosphere of oppression, to target any white person in pre-emptive self-defense.&lt;/i&gt;

This may explain why they feel threatened.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p><i>If it’s only logical to target members of the same race or religion when the threat is felt from simply that race and religion, then it’s logical for blacks, faced with nooses and shotguns in an atmosphere of oppression, to target any white person in pre-emptive self-defense.</i></p>
	<p>This may explain why they feel threatened.
</p>
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